Ellen White on Separation

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In considering Mrs. White's statement, she clearly said to consider time, place and circumstance.

It was an Adventist preacher, William Hanna, who in a little church in Plant City Florida, in the late 50s or early 60's, who suggested from the church pulpit the possibility that the Seventh-day Adventist church could fall, and I was dumbfounded. Like most Adventists, I was second in bigotry only to the Jews, as far as thinking that my religious beliefs and my church was infallible. Soon after, I lived next door to an SDA elderly couple who had been removed from the Battle Creek, Michigan, SDA church for nothing more than telling some very pure truth to a Sabbath School about the possible fall of the church. It is in the hopes of relieving my fellow Seventh-day Adventists of such bigotry as I had that this series will be posted on Adventist Issues. If the Jewish "chosen people" fell, what in the universe, brothers and sisters, has given us the notion that the SDA church militant cannot fall. I believe I have the answer to my question, and the answer is that Adventists have misread, misinterpreted and misapplied and misrepresented certain statements by Ellen G. White, our prophetess. I am presenting this posting in a series of postings on different days, so that I will not clog up the network with long postings.
My every effort in this series of posts is to give a fair presentation of little known and quite obscure Ellen White statements on the possibility of the fall of the church and separation, and to weigh them with her statements that "appear" to suggest there would never be any possibility of another separation. To readily familiarize the reader with what I have just stated, I would like you to consider the following statements after asking God to give you freedom from religious pride and bigotry. The following statements from the Spirit of Prophecy, and scripture, either imply or straight out specify the potential of ANOTHER COMING OUT. Regarding scriptural statements, please keep the following statement in mind:

"The Bible Prophets Wrote for Our Time.--Never are we absent from the mind of God. God is our joy and our salvation. Each of the ancient prophets spoke less for ther own time thn for ours, so that ther prophesying is in force for us. 'Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come ' (1 Cor. 10:11). 'Not unto themselves, but unot us they did minister the thngs, which are now reporte unto you by them taht have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven; which things the angels desire to look into' (1 Peter 1:12)." E.G. White, Selected Messages, vol. 3, 338.

Can we not reasonably conclude then, that scripture related to who leaves who, and where the tares are shaken into is appropos to us? With this in mind, let us peruse a few scriptural verses on this subject:

"And the REMNANT that is escaped of the house of Judah shall again take root downward, and bear fruit upward: For out of Jerusalem shall go forth a remnant, and they that escape out of mount Zion: the zeal of the Lord of hosts shall do this." Isaiah 37:31, 32.

Ellen White said that there will be another literal manifestation of Ezekiel 9, or the destruction of Jerusalem. She said that the first manifestation of Ezekiel 9, that is decribed in Chapter 1 of the Great Controversy, was a prefigure, The Great Controversy, p. 25, 1911 edition. Here are her statement:s:

"The prophecy which He [Christ] uttered was twofold in its meaning; while foreshadowing the destruction of Jerusalem, it prefigured also the terrors of the last great day." The Great Controversy, p. 25. Testimonies, vol. 5, 211, says that these terrors will begin at "His Sanctuary," "His Church," "the House of Jacob," those who have been blessed with great light. This terror will take place after the close of probation, but dear friend, if all the bad are shaken out of the church, why is a literal SDA church Sanctuary still in place, with men, maidens, and little children still remaining in it after the time of trouble and the close of probation? The first manifestation of Ezekiel 9, involved God's first "chosen" people holed up in a literal Sanctuary, and if that was a prefigure, then what about the anti-typical fulfillment, if that is to be worse than the type?

"Study the 9th chapter of Ezekiel. These words will be literally fulfilled." E.G. White, Manuscript Releases Volume One, p. 260.

A reasonable response to this verse would be to look at what God did in the first or typical fulfillment of this scripture in 70 A.D. She also said that the destruction of Jerusalem of A.D. 70, was a prefigure. A prefigure means a type, so that the antypical fulfillment would be similar and more of a primary fulfillment than the type or prefigure. Ezekiel, chapters 1-9, relate the reasons for the destruction of Chapter 9. Ezekiel 5:9, depicts that the worst manifestation of Ezekiel 9 is yet to come. Here is that verse:

"And I will do in thee that which I have not done, and whereunto I will not do any more the like, because of all thine abominations."

The implication is that God is goind to something worse than He has ever done before or will ever do again. That is why I believe that the next fulfillment of Ezekiel 9 is the primary and not secondary fulfillment. If we compare Ezekiel 5:9, with Matthew 24:21, Ezekiel and Matthew agree with my interpretation:

"For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be." Matthew 24:21.

In Ezekiel 5:9, God does the worst thing He ever did or will ever do again. They are one and the same event. Ezekiel 9, beginning at His Sanctuary and extending to the entire world. This is the primary destruction of which A.D. 70 was only a partial fulfillment. The worst thing God does is at the end of time after the close of probation.

How do we know that the Ezekiel 9 slaughter beginning at His Sanctuary, the professing SDA church militant, is after the close of probation? Because it begins at His Sanctuary AFTER the shaking, sifting, and separation has occurred from all sinners:

"The angel with the writer's inkhorn is to place a mark upon the foreheads of all who are separated from sin and sinners, and the destroying angel follows this angel." E.G. White Comments on Ezekiel 9, SDA Bible Commentary, vol. 4, 1161, col. 2.

The tares are not separated from the wheat until after the close of probation:

"The tares and the wheat are to grow together until the harvest; and the harvest is the end of probationary time." Christ's Object Lessons, 72.

If the tares are separated from the wheat until the harvest and the end of probaitonary time, how could the church militant be purged of all the bad to become the church triumphant during the time of trouble before probation closes, when the martyrs take place. Ellen White says there will be no martyrs after the close of probation because it would then serve no purpose!

  1. "
    "If doubts and unbelief ar cerished, the faithful ministers will be removed from the people who think they know so much. 'If thou hadst known, said Christ, 'even thou, at least in this thy day the things which belong unto they peace! but now they are hid from thine eyes." E.G. White, Testimonies to Ministers, 409-410. I was once asked the question: "What do you think about all the E.G. White statements saying that we should not leave the church?" That is a good and valid question, and must be considered along with the conditional statements Ellen White made suggesting the possible need to leave the church and/or implying such need to leave.

    Let us take a thoughtful and prayerful look at both types of Statements with their qualifying counterparts, which is something the SDA church and its members have failed to do in any honest way. The no-leave statements that are generally accepted as counsel that we should never leave the SDA church under any conditions; that the proverbial "SHIP" will finally go through no matter what the church does, have never been properly balanced with other qualifying statements to the contrary. Here we will attempt this long overdue task will all the fairness we can muster with God's help.

    1. "I testify to my bethren and sisters that the church of Christ, enfeebled and defective as it may be, is the only object on earth on which He bewtows His supreme regard. While He extends to all the world His invitation to come to Him and be saved, He commissions His angels to render divine help to every soul tht cometh to Him in repentance and contrition, and He comes personally by His Holy Spirit into the midst of His church." E.G. White, Testimonies to Ministers, p. 15.

      The above statement is qualifed in Acts of The Apostles, pp. 11, 12, to be the church triumphant in context. Here are the qualifying contextual statements: "The church is God's fortress, His city of refuge, which He holds in a revolted world. Any betrayal of the church is treachery to Him who has bought mankind with the blood of His only-begotten Son. From the beginning, FAITHFUL SOULS have constituted the church ON EARTH. In EVERY AGE the Lord has had HIS WATCHMEN, who have borne A FAITHFUL TESTIMONY TO THE GENERATION IN WHICH THEY LIVED. These SENTINELS gave THE MESSAGE OF WARNING; and when they were called to lay off their armor, others took up the word. God brought these witnesses into COVENANT REALTION with Himself, uniting the church on earth with the church in heaven. He has sent forth His angels to minister to His church, and the gates of hell have not been able to prevail against His people.


      Through centuries of persecution, conflict, and darkness, God has sustained His church. Not one cloud has fallen upon it tht He has not prepared for; not one opposing force has risen to counterwork His work, that He has not foreseen. All has taken place as He predicted. He has not left His church forsaken, but has traced in prophetic declarations what would occur, and that which His Spirit inspired the prophets to foretell has been brought about. All His purposes will be fulfilled. His law is linked with is throne, and no power of evil can destroy it. Truth is inspired and guarded by God; and it will triumph over all opposition.
      During ages of spiritual darkness the church of God has been as a city set on a hill. From age to age, through successive generations, the pure doctrines of heaven have been unfolding within its borders. Engeebled and defective as it may appear, the church is the one object upon which God bestows in a special sense His supreme regard. It is the theater of His grace, in which He delights to reveal His power to transform hearts." E. G. White, Acts of the Apostles, 11, 12.

      We are all familiar with the Church's statements about not joining ANY New Movement or ANY new organization. Some interpret these statements as meaning we should never leave the organized SDA church militant under any circumstances; that the bad will finall be shaken from the church militant to leave it the SDA Church Triumphant. But that position is erroneous if one follows the weight of evidence formula and interprets all of Ellen White's relative statements so that no contradiction is incurred.

      Ellen White qualified her statements about not joining ANY NEW MOVEMENT. She said we should never call the SDA Church that is keeping the commandments of God and heeding the Laodicean Message, Babylon, and that we should not leave such a church, because there would be no where else to go, and I completely agree with her.

      But what if a New Movement should form "among," within the professing SDA Church Militant, as Ellen White prophesied could occur in the Omega of A;postasy, Selected Messages, vol. 1, 204-205. What if that New Movement should do all that Ellen White prophesied it would, such as: The meaning of the statement in its full context alters its meaning totally. By the context in the above statement, the words "Enfeebled and defective as it may appear," refer to the church triumphant, and not to the church militant. Notice all the qualifying words in the above Acts of the Apostles statement:

      • From the beginning FAITHFUL SOULS have constituted the church ON EARTH.
      • In every age the Lord has had his warchment, who have borne A FAITHFUL TESTIMONY..."
      • These sentinels gave the "Message of Warning."
      • They were brought into "Covenant Relationship" with God.
      • These are the angels God has sent to minister to His church [militant--Patience, friend, this will be proven below].
      • Further proof that the "Enfeebled and Defective" statement means the Church Triumphant is that it is also stated in Selected Messages, vol. 2, p. 396, under the heading: "The Church Triumphant." The statement has been taken entirely out of context for decades and applied to the SDA Church militant. This is a great mistake, and Ellen White says so:

        "Those who think that the church militant is the church triumphant make a great mistake." E.G. White, The Upward Look, 152. Does the SDA Militant Become the Church Triumphant Sometime in the Future When The Bad Are Shaken Out of it? This is what the SDA church militant has taught since Ellen White's death, but it is true? Let's permit Ellen White to answer the question:

        "The members of the church triumphant--the church in heaven--wll be permitted to draw near to the members of the church militant, to aid them in their necessity." E. G. White, The southern Watchman, Sep. 8, 1903. (Taken from the Ellen White Estate Computer Disk containing all of Ellen White's releases and published writings).

        Now, pray tell, hou could members of the church triumphant--the church in heaven--be permitted to draw near to the members of the church militant, to aid them in their necessity, if they did not co-exist? The church in heaven has earthly representatives in every generation, faithful men, the third angel, who will come to the aid of those who are sincerely seeking truth and light, and will pass by all who refuse that light.

        "The angel represented in prophecy as delivering this message, symblizes a class of faithful men, who obedient to the promptings of God's Spirit and the teachings of His word, proclaim this warning to the inhabitants of earth. This message WAS NOT to be committed to the religious leader of the people [HIS PEOPLE--HIS CHURCH--in context]." E.G. White, The Spirit of Prophecy, vol. 4, 199, not to be confused with Testimonies, vol. 4.

        Statement That We Should Not Join Any New Movement or New Organization

        "Should Adventists Join Some New Movement?--[In the year 1893 Ellen G. White prepared this manuscript, in which she exposed the false teaching of two brethren who had prepared and were circulating a tract called the Loud Cry, denouncing the Seventh-da Adventist Church as Babylon. Her message is equally applicable today, for false teachers here and there are strangely burdened to denounce the Seventh-da Adventist Church, associating it, in varying degrees, with the great apostasy described in Revelation 18. The solems words of Mrs. White should open the eyes of all the honesthearted to the destructive proram carried on by the different 'offshoots' from the movememtn. Ths letter, recently released, ahs not before been published.--Editors] Review and Herald Articles, vol. 6, 513.

        Let us consider some of Ellen White's qualifying phrases in the above described article:

        • "The counsel of Christ to the Laodicean Church was being acted upon..." E.G. White, Review and Herald Articles, vol. 6, 513.

          It was definitely wrong to label as Babylon, an SDA church militant that was heeding and acting upon the Laodicean Message. This was Ellen White's qualification for not calling the church Babylon. Another qualification for not calling the SDA church in 1893 Babylon:

          "When anyone is drawing apart from the organized body of God's commandment-keeping people, when he begins to weigh the church in his human scales, and begins to pronounce judgment against them, then you may know that God is not leading him. He is on the wrong track."

          So, we may reasonably conclude so far from the article by Ellen White, that forming ANY NEW MOVEMENT, ANY NEW ORGANIZATION, and NOT KEEPING THE COMMANDMENTS OF GOD, AND TEACHING THAT THEY ARE IMPOSSIBLE TO KEEP, THEREBY MAKING IT IMPOSSIBLE TO HEED THE LAODICEAN MESSAGE, WAS STRICTLY TABOO! AND TO DO SO WOULD CONSITUTE ONE AS BEING ON THE SIDE OF BABYLON! The SDA Church militant of 1893, had not formed a New Movement, A New Organization and thus was meeting prime requirements of a valid church militant in 1893; heeding the Laodicean Message, and teaching and keeping the commandments of God. These are three of the prime qualifications as to why the SDA church of 1893 should not have been labelled Babylon. If faithfulness to these qualifications constituted the church as not being Babylon, then it follows that unfaithfulness to these requirements would constitute the church a part of Babylon, and not a valid church, let along church militant. Notice:

          "God has a church. It is not the great cathedral, neither is it the national establishment, neither is it the various denominations; it is the people who love God and keep His commandments. 'Where tow or thre are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them' (Matt. 18:20). Where Christ is even among the humble few, this is Christ's church, for the presence of the High and Holy One who inhabiteth eternity can alone constitute a church.
          Where two or thre are present who love and obey the comandments of God, Jesus there presides, let it be in the desolate place of the earth, in the wilderness, in te city enclosed in prison walls." E.G. White, The Upward Look, 131.

          We find in the above statements that God's presence is with those who keep His commandments out of a motive of love, and the presence of Christ is essential and can alone constitute a church. Then what do we do with the following statement:

          "The church is in the Laodicean state. The presence of God is not in her midst." Notebook Leaflets, p. 99, 1893, five years after the 1893 article.

          "To the end of time, the presence of the Spirit is to abide with the true church.' Acts of the Apostles, p. 55. Now, what if it can be proven that the SDA Church in 1999, is teaching that it is impossible to keep the commandments of God, and has thereby broken their covenant relationship with God, and has thereby REMOVED GOD'S PRESENCE, and has formed an apostate New Movement, New Organization, "AMONG", WITHIN," Seventh-day Adventism, that "would permit nothing to stand in its way." This will be the subject of part two in my series, so that my postings will not be too long!

          What About the Ellen White Prophecy That a Reformation Would Take Place in the SAD Church?

          What About the Ellen White Prophecy That God Would Purge and Purify His Church?

            Few are acquainte