Questions for John Scotram

 

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John Scotram of South America has constructed a powerpoint presentation of end-time events. http://www.lastcountdown.org/

This document presents some questions regarding the timeclock John has constructed.

 

Questions for John Scotram:

 

ďThe light that Daniel received from God was given especially for these last days. The visions he saw by the banks of the Ulai and the Hiddekel, the great rivers of Shinar, are now in process of fulfillment, and all the events foretold will soon [FUTURE] come to pass.Ē {TM 112.3, 113}

 

The light Daniel received in his visions by the banks of the Ulai and the Hiddekel is recorded in Daniel 8 and 10. See Daniel 8:2 on the Ulai and Daniel 10:4 on the Hiddekel. Remember, the great point is that ALL THE EVENTS of the visions by the Ulai and the Hiddekel WILL SOME COME TO PASS.

 

John, why would you ignore such an important statement in the construction of your time clock? Why did you ignore all the events foretold in Daniel 8 and 10?

 

On page 74 of John's powerpoint presentation, Daniel 12:5 and 7 are quoted as below. What John has overlooked is the fact that Ellen White said all of the events of Daniels vision by the Ulai and the Hiddekel would soon come to pass (future). I ask John if the voice between the banks of the Ulai (upon the waters of the river) in Daniel 8:16, is the same person speaking (Jesus) as is the man clothed in linen in Daniel 12:7? Why did you ignore Daniel 8 and this distinct connection with a vision Daniel expressly stated would be in the last end of the indignation--appointed at the time of the end?

 

"Dan 12:5 Then I Daniel looked, and, behold,

there stood other two, the one on this side

of the bank of the river, and the other on

that side of the bank of the river.

 

Dan 12:7 And I heard the man clothed in

linen, which was upon the waters of the

river, when he held up his right hand and

his left hand unto heaven, and sware by

him that liveth for ever,Jesus Himself. We are here

on holiest ground!"

 

16 And I heard a man's voice between the banks of Ulai, which called, and said, Gabriel, make this man to understand the vision. 17 So he came near where I stood: and when he came, I was afraid, and fell upon my face: but he said unto me, Understand, O son of man: for at the time of the end shall be the vision. 18 Now as he was speaking with me, I was in a deep sleep on my face toward the ground: but he touched me, and set me upright. 19 And he said, Behold, I will make thee know what shall be in the last end of the indignation: for at the time appointed the end shall be. Daniel 8:16-19.

 

 

Daniel 12


1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. 2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. 3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever. 4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased. 5 Then I Daniel looked, and, behold, there stood other two, the one on this side of the bank of the river, and the other on that side of the bank of the river. 6 And one said to the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, How long shall it be to the end of these wonders? 7 And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half; and when he shall have accomplished to scatter the power of the holy people, all these things shall be finished. 8 And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things? 9 And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end. 10 Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand. 11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days. 12 Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days. 13 But go thou thy way till the end be: for thou shalt rest, and stand in thy lot at the end of the days.

 

 

 

----- Original Message -----

From: James King

To: AdventistHotIssues@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 9:54 PM

Subject: [AdventistHotIssues] Prophetic time (length of) ...


John,

 

In your "clock" presentation, on Page (slide) number 86 you state:

 

p.86

How many earthly years correspond to one heavenly hour?

Answer: It is very easy now to find the answer. We know now that start and end of the judgment day are pointing to the same cipher in Godís Clock.

The Judgment will take all in all: 168 years

These 168 earthly years are deployed at 24 heavenly hours, the great day of Judgment.

Therefore one heavenly hour corresponds to: 168 / 24 = 7 earthly years.

Each elder who represents one heavenly hour corresponds therefore to a lapse of 7 earthly years.

----------------------

 

However, on the Page (slide) number 114 you state:

 

p.114

Now it should be clear that the seventh seal cannot be part of the Clock because it opens at the end of the time of plagues that will begin at the end of investigative Judgment day.

Rev 8:1 And when he had opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven about the space of half an hour.

Itís about the journey of Jesus with the new Jerusalem coming from Orion that will take 7 days or "half an hour" in prophetic time. Ellen White talks about the same time span in relation to the return of the New Jerusalem with all the redeemed to heaven:

 

Question:

 

If one prophetic (or as you put it: "heavenly") hour = 7 earthly years, then would not one-half hour = 3.5 years?

 

Or since 7 days is in fact "half an hour" in prophetic time, then shouldn't 14 or 15 days = 1 hour of prophetic (heavenly) time?

 

Please explain this conundrum.

 

Thank you

 

James

 

  

----- Original Message -----

From: James King

To: AdventistHotIssues@yahoogroups.com

Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 9:42 PM

Subject: [AdventistHotIssues] Close of Probation

 




John,

 

Your "clock" hypothesis states flat-out that the investigative Judgment "ends" in 2012.

 

In the correspondence you had with Ron, (per the documentation he shared with us today), you state that the investigative Judgment "ends" on Dec. 21, 2012, (to be more precise).

 

Question:

 

Would you be so kind as to reconcile your claim with EGWs statements (highlighted in RED) below.

 

No One Knows When Probation Will Close

God has not revealed to us the time when this message will close or when probation will have an end. Those things that are revealed we shall accept for ourselves and for our children, but let us not seek to know that which has been kept secret in the councils of the Almighty. . . . {LDE 227.1}

 

Letters have come to me asking me if I have any special light as to the time when probation will close, and I answer that I have only this message to bear, that it is now time to work while the day lasts, for the night cometh in which no man can work. --1SM 191 (1894). {LDE 227.2}

 

 

 

----- Original Message -----

From: jay james

To: Ron Beaulieu

Sent: Sunday, March 07, 2010 10:28 AM

Subject: Re: The Last Countdown

 

Ron,

 

Yesterday you asked me what I thought about http://www.lastcountdown.org/

 

Well, I haven't been through "all" of the website yet, but I did go throught the slideshow (which I initially thought was a video), of the "clock of God" in its entirety.

 

The "clock" presentation did make a few good points. The entire "concept" (ie: Orion = a "clock") is a bit far-out and in my opinion requires a lot of "stretching" to make the concept as a whole seem "legitimate". In short: Even though it is somewhat simple to understand, there's just too much speculation.

 

Methinks the fellow studied "Witness in the Stars", and then read into all the Bible/SOP passages related to "time" as well as Orion.

 

Also there are SEVERAL places that I have disagreement with the fellow.

 

For example, he refers to EGWs "time setting" comments and the supposed "context" she gave those statements. He is either ignorant or a flat-out liar. I mention this because he uses such "claim" to legitimize his hypothesis. (notice I did not say theory!). Note: I'm not referring to his "the jesuits have taken over" comments. I agree with those comments.

 

EGW was flat-out condemning folk for time setting the day of Jesus' return. Ol' boy says she was condemning them for something else.

 

Also, he flat-out claims that 12,21,12 is the very "day" that probation closes. Well as someone alive and paying attention in 3,07,10 --- I see a few problems with that notion.

 

Also, the fellow makes NUMEROUS mention of the SDAReform Church being "God's TRUE endtime Church". Well, I don't think I have to convince you of the problems associated with that claim! --- But if I had to convince him, I would surely mention Isaiah 4, as well as the fact that the phrase "Remnant Church" does NOT appear anywhere in Scripture, and only appears in EGWs writings after James White died and the "committee of five" began editing EGWs writings.

 

... and then, there are a few places wherein the fellow contradicts himself on somethings he said earlier.

 

Also, on the last three pages is a brief "Bio". The fellow specifically mentions that he is not yet a member of the SDARM. After all the points he makes about them [supposedly] being "God's TRUE endtime Church", and he is not yet a member with them?!?!?! --- It seems to me that if/when anyone discovers who they think is "God's TRUE endtime Church", then such folk would run towards such church even at the risk of getting a speeding ticket!

 

I only viewed the slideshow once, and it wasn't until around page 65 when it occurred to me to take actual "notes". So, I probably ought to re-view the entire thing and take more/better notes. But there's a very good Chanceability (that's a word I made up. It's a synonym for "likelihood". I'm thinking about contacting the dictionary and informing them -- hahahaa),

... there's a very good Chanceability that I won't re-view the slideshow and/or contact the dictionary. (smile!).

 

Below, I have listed some of the pages that I noticed "problems".

I have not yet "commented" on those problems. (I probably will do that later).

 

But for the time being, I'm passing this along "as-is". I have highlighted certain portions in RED and certain other portions in PINK. I'm sure you shouldn't have too much difficulty grasping the basic concept of my thoughts ....

 

Thus, overall I think the article as a whole -- is rubbish.

 

James

 

-----------------------

 

p.66

When did the rider on the white horse start

to ride?

Answer: In 1846

Event: Ellen G. White and her husband

Jaime accepted the Sabbath truth at

that year. Thereby the gospel were

cleansed after a very long time. The

pure gospel is symbolized by the "white

horse". Only the complete proclamation

of all original 10 commandments is a

"pure gospel".

Which people does know the answer?

All Seventh-Day-Adventists of all

denominations.

---------------

p.67

Answer: Even if we are using our naked eye or

binoculars, we are able to see that one of the

clock hand stars is colored in flaring red.

Therefore this has to represent the second

living creature which announces the second

seal respectively the red horse. Assuming that

the clock of God works in clockwise sense like

our human watches, we are now able to

connect all other clock hand stars with their

corresponding living creatures and seals.

--------------

P.84,85

When does the day of atonement

end in heaven?

Answer: As the study of Daniel 12 is showing us

the day of investigative judgment will take 168

years. It began in 1844 and therefore will end

in: 1844 + 168 = 2012.

Like in other clocks the cipher for 0 hours is the

same as for 12 respectively 24 hours. The

clock of God starts at 1844 and ends in 2012

which is one cycle round the 24 hour wheel:

1844 (start of investigative judgment) = 0 hours

2012 (end of investigative judgment) = 24 hours

Which people does know the answer?

The SDA rejected since 2005 the interpretation of

Daniel 12 and two other biblical studies that

lead to the same result. Now the knowledge

goes to everybody who wants to understand it.

--------------------------------

p.86

How many earthly years correspond

to one heavenly hour?

Answer: It is very easy now to find the answer.

We know now that start and end of the

judgment day are pointing to the same

cipher in Godís Clock.

The Judgment will take all in all: 168 years

These 168 earthly years are deployed at 24

heavenly hours, the great day of Judgment.

Therefore one heavenly hour corresponds to:

168 / 24 = 7 earthly years.

Each elder who represents one heavenly hour

corresponds therefore to a lapse of 7 earthly

years.

Which people does know the answer?

Only those who read and understand this

message.

-------------------------------------------

p.92.93,94,etc

1914 is a blameful date for the SDA church and a

glorious date for the real church of God, the SDA

Reformation Movement.

-----------------------

p.97

God shows us clearly with His Clock,

where His real Church is and which

church apostatized.

----------------

p.114

Now it should be clear that the seventh seal cannot be part of

the Clock because it opens at the end of the time of plagues

that will begin at the end of investigative Judgment day.

Rev 8:1 And when he had opened the seventh seal, there

was silence in heaven about the space of half an hour.

Itís about the journey of Jesus with the new Jerusalem

coming from Orion that will take 7 days or "half an hour" in

prophetic time. Ellen White talks about the same time span in

relation to the return of the New Jerusalem with all the

redeemed to heaven: ---------------- note by James: Here he contradicts himself! I do agree with 7 days = half an hour. Thus, 14 or 15 days = 1 full hour. But recall above (p.86) wherein he states: one heavenly hour corresponds therefore to a lapse of 7 earthly years. Therefore IF 1 hr = 7 yrs, by default, he should have said 1 half hour = 3.5 Years. So he clearly contradicted himself! --- end note.

 

We all entered the cloud together, and were seven days

ascending to the sea of glass, when Jesus brought the

crowns, and with His own right hand placed them on our

heads. (EW 16.2)

Take heed "opponents of time setting" that Ellen White herself would

have broken her own principle here if she would have related all of her

warnings regarding time setting to all prophecy after 1844. In the

majority of cases she wanted to point out that it is wrong to prolong the

2300 days with the other time lines of Daniel 12 directly. Revelation is

full of time spans (hours, days, half hours, months, 1260 days) that will

apply to the last events of mankind and Ellen White herself uses these

time spans in her prophetic books like above. It is part of the fraud in

SDA that everybody believes that all time calculation is firmly forbidden.

------------------------------

p.116

God wrote three historical epochs of the

Advent Movement into the sky at which the

people should be tested and sifted that they

would be ready for the last trial. This test will

come very soon but not before the 144,000

are gathered and sealed by the Holy Spirit

to give sound to the Loud Cry.

In Early Writings we read that the Voice of

God will announce the day and the hour of

Jesusí second coming and that this Voice

comes from Orion. Afterwards the people

enrages the nations with the Loud Cry.

The message includes the apostasy of the

Seventh-Day-Adventist Church and shows

where the real Church of God resides even

small in number:

The SDA Reformation Movement.

-----------------

p.118

2. The SDA Reformation Movement really got the

candlestick from Ephesus (Rev. 2:5) in 1914 and called

itself always rightfully the Movement of the Fourth

Angel which was sent to help the Third Angel.

Actually the following three verses resume the work of

the Reformation Movement since 1914 warning the

SDA members of the fallen state of their church:

Rev 18:1 And after these things I saw another angel

come down from heaven, having great power; and the

earth was lightened with his glory.

Rev 18:2 And he cried mightily with a strong voice,

saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is

become the habitation of devils, and the hold of

every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and

hateful bird.

Rev 18:3 For all nations

---------------------

p.122

This is the last Message God gives to His people to gather it

before the Loud Cry, showing the way to the SDA

Reformation Church where the doctrines of the pioneers

have been kept pure.

It is not a perfect church but a church that did everything to

be faithful to God, refuses to kill or transgress the Sabbath

even in war and even if it would cost jail or death and keeps

the marital votes even if this would mean to wait many years

for an unfaithful spouse and never associated with the world

or ecumenical movements. ------ note by James: I thought you said your SDARM church was Philadelphia! Is Philadelphia not "perfect"? Thus by your admission SDARM is not perfect then you MUST realize such admission proves SDARM os NOT Philadelphia. --- end note.

 

It is a church that did not abandon the belief in the Holy

Spirit as a Person like Ellen White declared several times

because otherwise it would be impossible to understand this

message.

God also wrote to the sky that the Godhead consists of

three Persons. Who does not believe in this cannot decipher

the Clock of God. And there is only one SDA Reformation

Movement that did not cast off this belief. God makes it very

clear where His real church is.

--------------

Note:

p.123

As we have shown in other studies the Vatican is now

ready to ride the beast of Revelation 17. On 10th of July

2009 the G20 have been established as the new

political power to lead the New World Order.

Some days before the pope solicited dominion over this

beast (G20) by the encyclical of Benedict XVI. At 10th of

July 2009 after the G20 summit Obama went directly to

the pope. They had a private meeting and Obama

conveyed the decision of the nations to the pope.

We are able to read what is going on behind the enemy

lines in the coat of arms of the pope and in the signet

the Vatican designed for the year of the Apostle Paul

that both carry coded messages of the Vatican itself

(more on www.lastcountdown.org)

From 07/10/2009 until the notorious 21st of December

2012 it is exactly 1,260 days, the last Judgment days.

God gathers now the 144,000 with a special message

that only they are able to understand and this work will

be finished by the Holy Spirit. Then persecution follows

(compare again the first vision of Ellen G. White).

--------------------

p.124

We are now in the 11th hour of the work.

Why? Take a look at the Clock again. The last hour began

7 years before 2012. This was the year 2005. God marked

the beginning of the last hour with the Great Tsunami on

Christmas 2004.

But why 11th hour, isnít it the 23rd? Because the 24 elders

represent the two covenants, the Old and the New

Testament.

The Judgment started with the dead saints, the first 12

elders, the Covenant with Abraham. Then the Judgment

went over to the living saints, the new 12 tribes of Israel,

the Covenant that Jesus made with His blood, the last 12

elders. We are in the last 12 hours of the last 12 elders

and therefore exactly in the 11th hour.

We are even in the last half an hour until the end of

Judgment Day in Heaven!!!

And therefore God is pleading us a very last time:

--------------

p.128

This is the same at the repetition of the churches. The

movement that leads to the gathering of the 144,000

who will receive the Holy Spirit and understand this

time message is the Movement of the Holy Spirit

Himself. In the end of times we are having three

messages, four angels and one agent of the Godhead.

This church, the church of the 144,000, will be the last

Philadelphia that results of the faithful of the SDA

Reformation Movement,

-------------

p.133

Finally we will make some more amazing discoveries that will

confirm again the Clock of God to be truth. For this we will use

modern technology to approach to the Most Holy and the Star of

Jesus:

But let us remember first:

The 144,000 were all sealed and

perfectly united. On their foreheads

was written, God, New Jerusalem,

and a glorious star containing

Jesus' new name. {EW 15.1}

Where in Orion is the Star of Jesus? The most left

outer star of the belt. And the belt stars all do have

age-old Arabic names.

-------------------

p.141

Could we even know the exact day of the end of the

investigative Judgment and if so, could we also know when

Jesus will come?

We are knowing the day of the

begin of the investigative

Judgment exactly. It would just be

logical if we also would know the

day of the end.

Ellen White saw that we would

know day and hour of Jesus

coming at the outpouring of the

Holy Spirit. Then we should be

able to know this right now. This

and other things we are going to

show at our web site

www.lastcountdown.org

------------------

p.142

Christ does NOT come in 2012!!!

Some are misunderstanding these

studies and think that we are saying

that Jesus comes in 2012. NO!

It is the year of the end of the

investigative Judgment. God ends

the Judgment if nobody cannot be

rescued anymore. In contrary in 2012

we expect such a deception of Satan

on earth that the door of mercy will be

shut for everybody who is keeping the

wrong Sabbath.

----------------------

p.144

About the author and these studies 1/3

The author of this study is just a Seventh-Day-Adventist who studies the

Bible and the Spirit of Prophecy. I am not a prophet. When I began these studies I still was completely convinced that the SDA church was the only and true church of God on earth and just followed some hints of Ellen G. White which chapters we should study carefully. I didnít know whereto these studies would lead me, but was very astonished about the horrible conditions in my local country church especially in the leadership. As soon as I recognized that the seals and churches of Revelation are repeating, (as we can learn at the example of Jericho) and that this must have something to do with the two World Wars, I started to investigate where would have been the martyrs in SDA history at the time of the World Wars.

I read a lot of books about SDA history but could not find anybody of SDA church who died for his faith at that time. Because I got the impression that there was something wrong I prayed even more intensely and asked God for clarification.

Already in 2005 I had found the year 2012 in the Bible and in the following years I presented two other corresponding studies to SDA church that never had been examined. But finally I found the SDA Reformation Movement in the Internet and got convinced that I had found the long searched martyrs there. Detailed studies about the history of the SDA Reformation Movement (SDARM) confirmed my first impression in a clear and alarming manner.

-----------------------

p.145

About the author and these studies 2/3

Personal visits at SDARM in my country and travels to other countries visiting

projects further confirmed that here was a people that in complete difference to

SDA keeps the commandments at highest level and holds to the doctrines of the

pioneers. The testimony of the brothers and sisters was awesome for me and my

wife who have been shocked in all the years because of the horrible behavior of

most SDA members and leaders in South America.

But of course there still arose doubts and insecurities. The same happened to

many of my SDA friends when I talked to them about my experiences. I asked

God again to intervene and to show me clearly the right way and He carried and

sustained me at that time. Therefore I finally resigned SDA membership in

October 2009 because I could not any longer identify myself with a church under

such conditions and apostasy as SDA showed at least in South America. Me and

my wife started to prepare for new baptism in SDARM

Although in 2007 I already had identified Orion as the Seat of God and

recognized also something like a watch that points to 2012 in the Throne Room

vision, God had held His Finger upon this study you are reading now. Yet in

Christmas 2009 at a missionary travel to Brazil the secret was revealed to me

and I got the inspiration for this study. I did not have a clue what dates or

messages would turn out and it was also for me myself a total surprise that God

showed me again in such a clear manner where His real Church was.

--------------

p.146

About the author and these studies 3/3

These studies are not known to SDARM at publication. I am not baptized at SDARM and God prevented so far that I would have an opportunity to present

these studies there. They have not been "inspired" in either way by SDARM.

The urgency of this subject does not allow me to wait any longer with publishing

my discoveries and to withhold the materials from the 144,000 giving it first to

General Conference approval. Thus at the moment I am nor SDA nor SDARM member and as I believe this is Godís providence because

IF THESE STUDIES WOULD RESULT ERRONEOUS THEN NOR SDA NOR

SDARM HAVE TO BE TAKEN RESPONSIBLE BUT THE AUTHOR HIMSELF.

"PROVE ALL THINGS; HOLD FAST THAT WHICH IS GOOD." {1Th 5:21}

These studies were made by a man who lives since 5 years at the country

side like Ellen White has counseled. He invests all his force and time into

the work of God. He is building a sanatorium which uses only natural

healing methods and a missionary school in South America with his own

modest financial resources. His wife and he are doing health work for the

population of one of the poorest countries of South America without any

financial interest.

---------------------------

p.147

A personal appeal

If you, dear sister, dear brother, have been convinced that this study is

worthy to be dispatched that it can help to gather the 144,000 and you are

able to speak a foreign language we would like to ask you to help us with

translation. We are also planning to provide web sites in different

languages. For this to happen we would need more help!

But you may help also just sending this PowerPoint message to all

your friends, relatives, brothers and sisters of all SDA denominations!

Thank you so much!

If you would like to participate in our work, please contact us using

the following e-mail address: info@lastcountdown.org

WE ARE PRAYING FOR ALL WHO READ THIS MESSAGE THAT THE

HOLY SPIRIT WILL GUIDE THEM IN ALL TRUTH!!!

Rev 22:20 He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I

come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus.

Rev 22:21 The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with you all.

Amen.



 

 

 



 

 

 

 

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