Answering
Objections #1
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Dear Reader, The person who
wrote to me as follows, has apparently become so ashamed of his statements
and responses to me, that he has asked me to remove his name, so I will
comply. He was involved in many
Internet exchanges on a public forum, SDAissues,
and has requested that I remove his name from all of the exchanges I had
documented on my Website. One would think that if he believed in his cause,
he would be glad to retain his evidence on my Website. ___________wrote: "Ron the wheat and tares grow
together until the harvest."
I know! That is why: · People in Jeremiah's day left the
tares and sacrificed at home. · Jesus left the apostate Jewish
church tares. · Paul left the apostate
Jewish tares within three months. · Protestants left Rome's tares. · True reformers have left the tares
in every succeeding generation since Christ, Desire of Ages, 232. · We are now in the harvest for the SDA
church because Ellen White says that only those who are separated from sin
and sinners will receive the Holy Spirit to give the Loud Cry WHEN THE SUNDAY
LAW COMES. So this proves that the harvest for the SDA church has to be
BEFORE the Sunday Law comes. Then the harvest for the other fallen
churches begins. · "The angel is to place a mark
upon the foreheads of all
who are separated from sin and sinners, and the destroying angel will follow to slay
utterly both old and young." 5T: 505. · On the typical Day of Pentecost,
the disciples of Jesus Christ were separated from sin and sinners at the
apostate Jewish church. So it will be
in the antitypical Day of Pentecost.
This separation must occur before the outpouring of the Holy Spirit at
the time of the National Sunday Law, for only those with the sealing mark of
Ezekiel 9, will receive that Holy Spirit to give the Latter Rain Loud Cry at
that time. · "As in the days of Noah and
Lot, there must be a marked separation from sin and sinners. There was a
coming out, a decided separation FROM the wicked, and escape for life. So it
was in the days of Noah, so with Lot; So with the
disciples prior to the destruction of Jerusalem; And so it will be in the
last days." E. G. White, Patriarchs
and Prophets, p. 167. What is the answer to this paradox?
When tares commit OPEN SIN APOSTASY, leave! "The recreant priests added
licentiousness to the dark catalogue of their crimes yet they still polluted
by their presence the tabernacle of the Lord, and, laden with sin, dared to
come into the presence of a holy God. As the men of Israel witnessed the
corrupt course of the priests, they thought it safer for their families not
to come up to the appointed place of worship. Many went from Shiloh with
their peace disturbed, their indignation aroused, until they at last
determined to offer their sacrifices themselves, concluding that this would
be fully as acceptable to God, as to sanction in any manner the abominations
practiced in the Sanctuary." E.G. White, The Signs of the Times, vol. 1,
p. 264, col. 3, December 1, 1881. "They that forsake the law
praise the wicked.' Proverbs 28:4. When those who are uniting with the world,
yet claiming great purity, plead for union with those who have ever been the opposers
of the cause of truth, we should fear and shun them as decidedly as did
Nehemiah. Such counsel is prompted by the enemy of all good. It is the speech
of timeservers, and should be resisted as resolutely today as them. Whatever
influence would tend to unsettle the faith of God's people in His guiding
power, should be steadfastly withstood." E.G. White, Prophets and Kings,
p. 661. "Those who are uniting with
the world [and
churches that cannot be distinguished from the world, Early Writings, 273] are receiving the worldly mold and
preparing for the mark of the beast." Testimonies, vol. 5, 216." "The Sanhedrin had rejected
Christ's message and was bent upon His death therefore Jesus departed from
Jerusalem, from the priests, the temple, the religious leaders, the people
who had been instructed in the law, and turned to another class to proclaim
His message, and to gather out those who should carry the gospel to all
nations. As the light and life of men was rejected by the ecclesiastical
authorities in the days of Christ, so it has been rejected in every succeeding generation. Again and again the history of
Christ's withdrawal from Judea has been repeated. When the Reformers preached
the word of God, they had no thought of separating themselves from the
established church but the religious leaders would not tolerate the light,
and those that bore it were forced to seek another class, who were longing
for the truth. In our day few of the professed followers of the Reformers are
actuated by their spirit. Few are listening for the voice of God, and ready
to accept truth in whatever guise it may be presented. Often those who follow
in the steps of the Reformers are forced to turn away from the churches they
love, in order to declare the plain teaching of the word of God. And many
times those who are seeking for light are by the same teaching obliged to
leave the church of their fathers, that they may render obedience." E.G.
White, Desire of Ages, p. 232. Home Churches taught in
Scripture Act 13:1 Now there were in the
church that was at Antioch certain prophets and teachers; as Barnabas, and
Simeon that was called Niger, and Lucius of Cyrene, and
Manaen, which had been brought up with Herod the tetrarch, and Saul. Rom 16:5 Likewise [greet] the
church that is in their house. Salute my well beloved Epaenetus, who is the
firstfruits of Achaia unto Christ. Phm 1:2 And to [our] beloved Apphia,
and Archippus our fellow soldier, and to the church in thy house: 1Cr 16:19 The churches of Asia
salute you. Aquila and Priscilla salute you much in the Lord, with the church
that is in their house. Col 4:15 Salute the brethren which
are in Laodicea, and Nymphas, and the church which is in his house. 1 Corinthians 14:26 describes an
early church meeting, in which everyone present shared in providing hymns,
instruction, revelation, tongues, or interpretation. 1Cr 14:26 How is it then, brethren?
when ye come together, every one of you hath a
psalm, hath a doctrine, hath a tongue, hath a revelation, hath an
interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying. Act 14:23 And when they had
ordained them elders in every church, and had prayed with fasting, they
commended them to the Lord, on whom they believed. Act 14:27 And when they were come,
and had gathered the church together, they rehearsed all that God had done
with them, and how he had opened the door of faith
unto the Gentiles. 1Pe 5:13 The [church that is] at
Babylon, elected together with [you], saluteth you; and [so doth] Marcus my
son. Rom 16:1 I commend unto you Phebe
our sister, which is a servant of the church which is at Cenchrea: Col 4:16 And when this epistle is
read among you, cause that it be read also in the church of the Laodiceans;
and that ye likewise read the [epistle] from Laodicea. 1Cr 1:2 Unto the church of God
which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called [to
be] saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ
our Lord, both theirs and ours: "There is a little hope in one
direction: Take the young men and women, and place them where they will come
as little in contact with our churches as possible, that the low grade of
piety which is current in this day shall not leaven their ideas of what it
means to be a Christian." E.G. White, Manuscript Release #995, p. 5. Ron responds: ___________, Evidently, God does not consider sighing and crying
for ALL the abominations, as "hurling thunderbolts" against the
church militant, or He would not have made such a CONDITION for being
sealed. Did God contradict Himself. Did
Ellen White contradict God? That is why your interpretation of Ellen
White's statements on thunderbolts achieves. That is all it
achieves! Again, you make Ellen White contradict God and herself.
Back to ground zero ________. That bat you've been swing at me has hit
your head too many times on your backswing, so that by the time it gets near
my head, your swing has no power left. Those are the kind of
beatings I can take all day long. Indifference and Neutrality in a Crisis: "If
God abhors one sin above another, of which HIS PEOPLE are guilty, it is of
doing nothing in a case of emergency. Indifference or neutrality in a
religious crisis is regarded of God as a grievous crime and equal to the very
worst type of hostility against God." E.G. White, Review and Herald,
vol. 1, p. 136. Also, Testimonies, vol. 3, p. 281. "For evils that we might have checked, we are
just as responsible as if we were guilty." Desire of Ages, p. 44. "Therefore also said the wisdom of God, I will
send them prophets and apostles, and some of them they shall slay and
persecute: That the blood of all the prophets, which was shed from the
foundation of the world, may be required of this generation From the blood of
Abel unto the blood of Zacharias, which perished between the altar and the
temple: verily I say unto you, It shall be required of this generation. Woe
unto you, lawyers! for ye have taken away the key of
knowledge: ye entered not in yourselves, and them that were entering in ye
hindered." Luke 11:49-52. "The plain straight testimony must live in the
church, or the curse of God will rest upon His people as surely as it did
upon ancient ----- Original Message ----- From: ____________ To: SDAIssues@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 1:02 PM Subject: Re: [SDAIssues] Re: check out this Then stop hurling thunderbolts at the Church
Ron, that's a No No
-------Original
Message------- From: Ron Beaulieu Date: 05/24/06 13:57:18 To: SDAIssues@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [SDAIssues] Re: check out this Ron responds, ___________, I fully agree that we are not to hurl thunderbolts
at the church militant WHEN IT IS DOING AS IT SHOULD. But Ellen White said let there be WAR
rather than unity with apostate error.
Consider that before the other churches fell in 1844, they were the
church militant. Did SDA's hurl
thunderbolts at them and call they Babylon, when
they rejected present truth? Oh
yes! Do they do it still? Oh yes! Regular lines - “So often the same old difficulties
arise and are presented in regard to disturbing the ‘regular lines.’ But God
will work in some way to make His people understand that THE REGULAR LINES
HAVE BECOME FULL OF IRREGULAR PRACTICES…God alone can make men understand
that working on REGULAR LINES has led to IRREGULAR PRACTICES. God alone can make men’s minds as they
should be. The time has come when we
should hear les in favor of the REGULAR LINES. If we can GET AWAY FROM THE REGULAR LINES
into something which, THOUGH IRREGULAR, IS AFTER GOD’S ORDER, it may cut away
something of the IRREGULAR WORKING which has led away from Bible
principles.” E.G. White, Manuscript
Release, #1450, p. 3, 4, 1901. “When we see the regular lines are altered and
purified and refined, and the God of the heavens mold is upon the regular
lines, then it is our business to establish the regular lines.” E.G. White, Spaulding-Magan Collection, p.
162-168. “The present showing is sufficient to prove to all
who have the true missionary spirit that the regular lines [organization] may
prove to be a failure.” E.G. White,
Spaulding-Magan Collection, p. 175.
Written to Brother Daniels, June 28, 1901. “The regular lines had need
to be broken as a potter’s vessel is broken, and reconstructed.” Ms. 29, 1903.
pp. 1, 3 (General Manuscript, The Southern Work, undated. Ron ----- Original Message ----- From: _____________ To: SDAIssues@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 12:38 PM Subject: Re: [SDAIssues] Re: check out this We are not to hurl the thunderbolts against the
church of Christ militant, for Satan is doing all he possibly can in this
line, and you who claim to be the remnant of the people of God had better not
be found helping him, denouncing, accusing, and condemning. Seek to restore,
not to tear down, discourage, and destroy.--Manuscript 21, 1893. -------Original
Message------- From: Ron Beaulieu Date: 05/24/06 13:32:52 To: SDAIssues@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [SDAIssues] Re: check out this Forum, Errors and defects are quite different from gross,
unpardonable sin apostasy. Notice that
the Old Testament prophets did not mention any good things about apostate
Israel. There are
no "good things" in God's sight, if they are admixed with strange
fire. Ron ----- Original Message ----- From: ____________ To: SDAIssues@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, May 24, 2006 12:09 PM Subject: Re: [SDAIssues] Re: check out this Satan is
"the accuser of the brethren," and it is his spirit that inspires men
to watch for the errors and defects of the Lord's people, and to hold them
up to notice, while their good deeds are passed by without a mention. {GC88
395.2} -------Original Message------- From: godislove144 Date: 05/24/06 13:02:21 To: SDAIssues@yahoogroups.com Subject: [SDAIssues] Re: check out this Ron responds, ___________, And Ron and I have given some quotes that have
PROVEN that you take the SOP out of context.
Furthermore, you haven't even properly addressed those quotes, Ron and
I have addressed the quotes you guys have provided. Maybe if you stopped with your monkey jokes
and Ad Hominem arguments, you might have a bit of progress in addressing the
quotes we provide. Oh and...just for the record, statements like "So Ellen White
is your God now" are not very good arguments against our cause. Jay |