Response to Bryan Bissell's Rebuttal to Ron #1
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Dear Reader, This document is in response to Bryan Bissell’s rebuttal to
my rebuttal to him and Ulicia Unruh. There is one person involved herein who has shifted sides so many
times now that he is embarrassed for his name to be included, so I have
omitted it. The reason that I have chosen to post to my Website only is that
I do not have time to write to all of the various Internet email groups and
many will not tolerate the light. I hereby promise to publish any
Ellen White statement that anyone sends to me for publication. Signed: Ron
Beaulieu. So let it never again be falsely
charged that I shy away from any statement(s) by Ellen White or scripture! I
have never tried to shy away from any statement by Ellen White or the Bible.
Rather, I have interpreted them all according to the weight of evidence
formula as prescribed by Ellen White. Anyone can make Ellen White say many
contradictory things without strict adherence to the following formula: 1.
Weight of Evidence
Formula: "1. Every word must have its proper bearing on the subject
presented in the Bible 2. All Scripture is necessary, and may be understood
by diligent application and study 3. Nothing revealed in Scripture can or
will be hid from those who ask in faith, not wavering 4. To understand
doctrine, bring all the scriptures together on the subject you wish to know,
then let every word have its proper influence and if you can form your theory
without a contradiction, you cannot be in error 5. Scripture must be its own
expositor, [interpreter] since it is a rule of itself. If I depend on a
teacher to expound to me, and he should guess at its meaning, or desire to have
it so on account of his sectarian creed, or to be thought wise, then his
guessing, desire, creed, or wisdom is my rule, and not the Bible." E.G.
White, Second Advent Review and
Herald, 11-25-34, pr. 24. Now to Bryan’s rebuttal: ----- Original Message ----- From: Bryan Bissell
To: SDAIssues@yahoogroups.com ; defendEGW@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, June 02, 2007 10:22 AM Subject: [DefendEGW] Re: [SDAIssues] Check this
out Bryan Bryan,
Ron comments: I
did not respond exclusively to Ulicia. Anything I said to her applied to
Bryan, as they both argue the same things. I am including all and any quotes
that Bryan or anyone else cares to send along to me. Bryan Bissell, Ulicia
Unruh and most SDA’s employ the following statements by Ellen White to try to
imply that no matter what the church has done by way of omega apostasy, it is
still God’s chosen instrument. Like the Jews of old, SDA’s are just as prone
to UNCONDITIONALLY apply promises by their prophet to them. This is most
unfortunate. Bryan stated above:
“The statements of EGW
about SDA go way beyond anything the Bible said about Israel as far as SDA
going through to the end.” Bryan’s
statement is manifestly untrue. God made very UNCONDITIONAL “SOUNDING”
promises to the Jews which they clearly misinterpreted as we will see in this
document! End comment.
Ron comments: I
am very sure that the God of Israel (true Israel) is still guiding His people
and that He will continue to be with them, even to the end. His people are
those who keep the commandments of God and heed the Laodicean message as well
as the three angel’s messages and the Midnight Cry WITHOUT DRAWING BACK IN
ANY WAY FROM THOSE MESSAGES and conditions.
Ron’s comment: I
don’t question that Ellen White was speaking of God’s people. But we better
know the conditions for whom God considers His people. Ron comments: I added the all emphases to the words perfectly united above.
This quote has some very qualifying words that most SDA will fail to discern: ·
God
did indeed call the Adventist people to be His peculiar treasure. That call
has been rejected by the ecumenical liaison the church has established with
Babylon, in violation of the first and second angel’s messages and the
Midnight Cry of Matthew 25, which Ellen White said gave power to the second
angel’s message. ·
Ellen
White said elsewhere that the 144,000 will be perfectly united. She said that
they are translated without seeing death. She said that only they go into the
Temple on Mt. Zion. EW, p. 19. ·
The
SDA church militant is FAR FROM PERFECTLY UNITED. This should be clear and
perfect empirical evidence that Ellen White WAS NOT speaking of that church, for
if she was, the huge division in the church since the 1970’s would make her a
very false prophet. ·
Thus,
the way the statement is interpreted, all who interpret it as Bryan, Ulicia
and most SDA’s do, make Ellen White a false prophet by their own misrepresentation
of the facts. ·
There
are always two churches of God at work on earth. 1.
The
church militant wheat and tare co-ed church which qualifies as a church IF it
is keeping the commandments of God and heeding the Midnight Cry and the three
angel’s messages. 2.
The
church triumphant which in the form of true reformers who are ever present in
the earth as representatives of the church of Hebrews 12:22, 23: "The members
of the church triumphant--the church in heaven--will be permitted to draw
near to the members of the church militant, to aid them in their
necessity." E. G. White, The Southern Watchman, Sep. 8, 1903. Fact number 2
above is a little known and recognized truth in Adventism. It is taught only
by true reformers who are called by God: "Characteristics of True Reformers.--Here [Isa.
8:11-14] are given the characteristics of those who shall be reformers, who
will bear the banner of the third angel’s message, these who avow themselves
God's commandment-keeping people, and who honor God, and are earnestly
engaged, in the sight of all the universe, in building up the old waste
places. Who is it that calls them, The repairer of the breach, The
restorers of paths to dwell in? It is God. Their names are registered
[written--Heb. 12:22, 23] in heaven as reformers, restorers, as raising the
foundations of many generations." E. G. White, SDA Bible Commentary, Vol. 4, 1151. God first called
the Jews as His peculiar treasure unto Himself. They rejected His conditions
even though He made some pretty mighty FOREVER SOUNDING PROMISES TO THEM, to
wit: God's promises are all made
upon conditions. Faith and Works, p.47 God would in no wise excuse sin in a people
who had been enlightened, even if He had, in their days of
faithfulness and purity, loved them, and given them especial promises.
These promises and blessings were always upon condition of obedience upon
their part. SOP, Vol. 2, p.54. God had given them [Jews] His gracious
promise that they should become a peculiar treasure unto Him, on condition of
obedience; but if they were disobedient He would reject them, and
choose another people. Signs
of the Times, Vol. 1, p. 152. Promises the Jews misinterpreted --
"The Jews had deceived themselves by misinterpreting the words of the
Lord through his prophets, of his eternal favor to his people Israel. 'Thus saith the Lord, which giveth the
sun for a light by day, and the ordinances of the moon and of the stars for a
light by night, which divideth the sea when the waves thereof roar the Lord
of hosts is his name: If those ordinances depart from before me, saith the
Lord, then the seed of Israel also shall cease from being a nation before me
forever. Thus saith the Lord: If heaven above can be measured, and the
foundations of the earth searched out beneath, I will also cast off all the
seed of Israel for all that they have done, saith the Lord.' Jer. 31:35-37. These words the Jews applied to
themselves. And because God had shown them so great favor and mercy, they
flattered themselves that, notwithstanding their sins and iniquities, he
would still retain them as his favored people, and shower especial blessings
upon them. They misapplied the words of Jeremiah and depended for their
salvation upon being called the [chosen] children of Abraham. If they had
indeed been worthy of the name of Abraham's children, they would have
followed the righteous example of their father Abraham, and would have done
the works of Abraham. This has been the danger of the people of God in all ages and
especially is this the danger of those living near the close of time. . . . God would in no wise excuse sin in a
people who had been enlightened, even if he had, in their days of
faithfulness and purity, loved them, and given them especial promises. These
promises and blessings were always upon condition of obedience upon their
part. The Lord pronounced, by the mouth of
Moses, blessings upon the obedient, and curses upon the disobedient." E.
G. White, Review and
Herald, Vol. 1, 123. End Ron’s
Comment.
Ron’s Comments: ·
If
the church militant was restored from all its backslidings, Ezekiel 9 would never
be literally fulfilled within its courts. Ellen White says that chapter will
be literally fulfilled. ·
Isaiah
62 says very plainly who is to be the light of the world. All the world will
see her righteousness. It is Zion, and Zion is the prime player in the Bible.
You had better know who Zion is. She is the bride that is married, verses
1-5. That is the church triumphant, obviously! Even Jesus’ church had serious
faults in the person of His very disciples. But they did not join in any
liaison with Babylon. Jesus does not marry a harlot. God does not choose a
harlot as a bride for His Son. Isaiah Chapter
62
1 For Zion's sake will I not hold my peace, and for Jerusalem's sake I will not rest, until the righteousness thereof go forth as brightness, and the salvation thereof as a lamp that burneth. 2 And the Gentiles shall see thy righteousness, and all kings thy glory: and thou shalt be called by a new name, which the mouth of the LORD shall name. 3 Thou shalt also be a crown of glory in the hand of the LORD, and a royal diadem in the hand of
thy God. 4 Thou
shalt no more be termed Forsaken; neither
shall thy land any
more be termed Desolate: but thou shalt be called Hephzibah, and
thy land Beulah: for the LORD delighteth in
thee, and thy land shall be married. 5 For as a
young man marrieth a virgin, so shall thy sons marry thee: and as the bridegroom rejoiceth over the bride, so shall
thy God rejoice over thee. 6 I have set watchmen upon thy walls, O Jerusalem, which shall never hold their peace day nor night: ye that make mention of the LORD, keep not silence, 7 And give him no rest, till he establish, and till he make Jerusalem a praise in
the earth. 8 The LORD hath sworn by his right hand, and by the arm of his strength, Surely
I will no more give thy corn to be meat for
thine enemies; and the sons of the stranger shall not drink thy wine, for the which thou hast laboured: 9 But
they that have gathered it
shall eat it, and praise the LORD; and they that have brought it together shall drink it in the courts of my holiness. 10 Go through, go through the gates; prepare ye the way of the people; cast up, cast up the highway; gather out the
stones; lift up a standard for the people. 11 Behold, the LORD hath proclaimed unto the end of
the world, Say ye to the daughter of Zion, Behold, thy salvation cometh;
behold, his reward is with him, and his work before him. 12 And they shall call them, The holy people, The redeemed of the LORD: and thou shalt be called, Sought out, A city not forsaken. More proof that Zion is the church triumphant and not
any church militant (wheat and tare co-ed church): 22 But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of
angels, 23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which
are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect, Hebrews 12:22, 23. “All the disciples had serious faults when Jesus called them to
His service. Even John, who came into closest association with the meek and
lowly One, was not himself naturally meek and yielding. He and his brother
were called ‘the sons of thunder’. . Jesus reproved His disciples, He warned
and cautioned them; but John and his brethren did not leave Him; they chose
Jesus, notwithstanding the reproofs. The Saviour did not withdraw from them
because of their weakness and errors. They continued to the end to share His
trials and to learn the lessons of His life. By beholding Christ, they became
transformed in character.”—Desire of
Ages, 294-296.
End Ron’s comment. Ron comments: I
would never claim that the true SDA church is Babylon. I would have no qualms
claiming that a New Movement masquerading as the SDA church, and which has
removed God, is indeed part of Babylon. 1SM 204-5. It is indeed a
lack of honor and integrity to misrepresent and misinterpret the promises of
God and Ellen White to the church as UNCONDITIONAL. Another quote used often
by the person who wishes to be not be named is: No advice or
sanction is given in the Word of God to those who believe the third angel's
message to lead them to suppose that they can draw apart. This you may settle
with yourselves forever. It is the devising of unsanctified minds that would
encourage a state of disunion…. There must be no separating in this great
testing time. (Selected
Messages, Vol. 3, p. 21.) Ron responds:
The qualifying words in the above statement are “to those who believe the
third angel’s message.” It is manifest unbelief in those messages to grossly
violate them via ecumenical fraternity with Babylon. The following message is
partially apropos at this time in the history of the professing New Movement SDA
church. I say “partially,” because many of Sessler’s quotes with ellipses are
taken deceptively out of context. Nearly every quote is includes ellipses
which would involve a monumental task to validate for correctness. This is
why I have never endorsed Robert Sessler’s work as a whole. http://www.lightministries.com/SDA/Booklets/id119.htm "The Lord
Jesus will always have a chosen people to serve Him. When the Jewish people
rejected Christ, the Prince of life. He took from them the kingdom of God and
gave it unto the Gentiles. God will
continue to work on this principle with every branch of His work. When a
church proves unfaithful to the work of the Lord, whatever their position may
be, however high and sacred their calling, the Lord can no longer work with
them. Others are then chosen to bear important responsibilities. But, if
these in turn do not purify their lives from every wrong action, if they do
not establish pure and holy principles in all their borders, then the Lord
will grievously afflict and humble them and, unless they repent, will remove
them from their place and make them a reproach. God is not
'worshipped with men's hands, as though he needed any thing' (Acts 17:25). E.
G. White, The Upward
Look, 131. The Prophesied Fall of The Professing
Seventh-day Adventist Church The
following statement applies to all fallen churches at the end-time, but
especially the one to which the messages of Revelation 14 were commissioned: "Jesus sends HIS PEOPLE a
message of warning to prepare them for his coming. To the prophet John was
made known the closing work in the great plan of man's redemption. He beheld
an angel flying 'in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to
preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred,
and tongue, and people, saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to
him for the hour of his Judgment is come and worship him that made heaven,
and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters [Rev. 14:6, 7.]. The angel represented in prophecy as
delivering this message, symbolizes a class of faithful men, who,
obedient to the promptings of God's Spirit and the teachings of his word,
proclaim this warning to the inhabitants of earth. This message was not to be
committed to the religious leaders of the people. They had failed to preserve
their connection with God, and had REFUSED THE LIGHT FROM HEAVEN therefore
they WERE NOT of the number described by the apostle Paul: 'But ye, brethren,
are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. Ye are all
the children of light, and the children of the day we are not of the night
nor of darkness' [1 Thess. 5:4, 5]. The watchmen upon the walls of Zion
should be the first to catch the tidings of the Saviour's advent, the first
to lift their voices to proclaim him near, the first to warn the people to
prepare for his coming. But they were at ease, dreaming of peace and safety,
while the people were asleep in their sins. Jesus saw HIS CHURCH, like the
barren fig-tree, covered with pretentious leaves, yet destitute of precious
fruit. There was a boastful observance of the forms of religion, while the
spirit of true humility, penitence and faith--which alone could render the
service acceptable to God--was lacking. Instead of the graces of the Spirit,
there were manifested pride, formalism, vainglory, selfishness, oppression. A
BACKSLIDING CHURCH closed their eyes to the signs of the times. God did nor
forsake them, or suffer his faithfulness to fail but they departed from him,
and SEPARATED THEMSELVES from his love. As they REFUSED TO COMPLY WITH
THE CONDITIONS, his promises were NOT FULFILLED to them." E.G.
White, The Spirit of Prophecy, vol. 4, pp. 199-200 [The 1884
edition of The Great Controversy, NOT TO BE CONFUSED WITH TESTIMONIES, VOL
4]. God bless, Ron |