Dear Reader,
The following exchange took place on an SDA Internet Chat group between a gentleman named Kevin and one named Walt:
Hi Kevin--You wrote:
"Ellen White herself said her teachings should be submitted to the authority of the Bible, and that if we had listened to the Bible we wouldn't have needed her in the first place.
----- Here is a statement or two to the effect of the above:
"The Word of God is sufficient to enlighten the most beclouded mind, and may be understood by those who have any desire to understand it. But notwithstanding all this, some who profess to make the Word of God their study, are found living in direct opposition to its plainest teachings. Then, to leave men and women without excuse, God gives plain and pointed testimonies, bringing them back to the Word that they have neglected to follow. The Word of God abounds in general principles for the formation of correct habits of living, and the Testimonies, general and personal, have been calculated to call their attention more especially to these principles.--Testimonies, vol. 5, pp. 663, 664. (1889) {Ev 256.4}"
"In the Scriptures God has set forth practical lessons to govern the life and conduct of all; but though He has given minute particulars in regard to our character, conversation, and conduct, yet in a large measure, His lessons are disregarded and ignored. Besides the instruction in His Word, the Lord has given special testimonies to His people, not as a new revelation, but that He may set before us the plain lessons of His Word, that errors may be corrected, that the right way may be pointed out, that every soul may be without excuse.-- Letter 63, 1893. (See Testimonies, vol. 5, p. 665.) {3SM 31.3}"
"I was referred to this scripture: "Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof. Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God." Professed Christians, if no further light is given you than that contained in this text, you will be without excuse if you suffer yourselves to be controlled by base passions. {2T 454.3}
The word of God is sufficient to enlighten the most beclouded mind and may be understood by those who have any desire to understand it. But notwithstanding all this, some who profess to make the word of God their study are found living in direct opposition to its plainest teachings. Then, to leave men and women without excuse, God gives plain and pointed testimonies, bringing them back to the word that they have neglected to follow. Yet those who serve their own lusts turn from all this light. They will not cease their course of sin, but continue to take pleasure in unrighteousness in the face of the threatenings and vengeance of God against those who do such things. {2T 454.4}"
"For years the Spirit of God has reproved and exhorted the professed followers of Christ, and has left us without excuse in pursuing evil ways, in criticising and finding fault with the message and the messenger whom God has sent. Shall we who cannot read the secrets of the heart reject the message of reproof, and presume to say that we are without fault? It is perilous to permit prejudice to arise in your hearts and speak against those upon whom sacred responsibility is laid, permitting yourselves to be influenced by a report that has come to your ears of which you have never sought for an explanation from the one accused. You may see the peril of such a course by reading concerning the course of Aaron and Miriam, when they spoke against Moses because of his marriage with one who did not meet their mind. And they said, "Hath the Lord indeed spoken only by Moses? hath he not spoken also by us? And the Lord heard it. (Now the man Moses was very meek, above all the men which were upon the face of the earth.)"
God could see the meekness of Moses; but his own brother and sister failed to see it, and though they had been his daily companions, they really thought that Moses was exalting himself above them, when he was doing with meekness and fidelity what the Lord had directed him to do. {RH, July 18, 1893 par. 6}"
We should do well to remember what God is trying to do, and that we serve a God of mercy. In the cases that are soon to transpire and be heard in the heavens, it will be obvious as to who are His children and who are not. God will clear His name, and every tongue will admit that God was fair and just.
Who can say that our God who has now sent us these words by the hand of His messenger (prophet if you will), has done a vain thing? See Isa. 55:11 KJV. He is God. He knows what we need, and the way. Shall we turn away and say "not that way Lord"? Time is short and the harvest must be brought in on time.
We are just men and should know our place. In a word: "humility". What do we know anyway?
Think of the universe and all that we see and know. The things we see and know are a very small part of that which can be known. We must realize how very small we are, before we are ready to learn.
Shall we not become as little children then? We need to learn to love correction for it is stated that "Whoso loveth instruction loveth knowledge: but he that hateth reproof is brutish." Prov. 12:1
How can we decide for ourselves which of the blessings the Lord shall send, are appropriate and which are not? Who are we to know? Well faith in God demands that we know that God will only do good always, and we need to learn to accept all the gifts and blessing He sends, whether we think we need them or not.
A simple truth is that we as men, hardly know what we need until we have (received), it. Think about this for a moment and go back in time. Do you have a computer, radio, car, telephone etc., etc? We must receive the truth then, to know its full importance, and thereby realize that it (the present truth, whatever it happens to be at the time), is something that we cannot live without.
Again Kevin, you state:
"She also said she was not infallible. Those who make her so, and place her as equal to the Bible are going against her own counsel."
----- No quote or references are given to affirm or disaffirm whether or not we are against "her own counsel", but there are two different items here for us to consider.
We should remember the story of Balaam, for the Lord went through the trouble of telling the story in detail to prove one thing for sure. A person may be as seemingly corrupt in desire and motive as was Balaam, but when he speaks for (or writes in), in the name of the Lord, his words must be true.
Deut. 18 contains the rule:
"I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him." v. 18
Here we see that the new prophet will be one familiar with, and believing the old message. God never sent one that was not an Israelite (His church in ancient times), as a prophet to His People.
"And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him." v. 19
Notice here, that the Lord now calls the words that the prophet speaks in His name "My words"?
"But the prophet, which shall presume to speak a word in my name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, even that prophet shall die." v. 20
We can easily see that God is not fooling around with this item of one claiming to be His special messenger. On examination it is revealed that when one claims to speak in the name of the Lord, they must be correct 100% of the time.
Now of course, the messenger being as other men, may be expected to make mistakes in normal conversation and in daily practise. The word that they claim to come in the name of the Lord cannot be judged by that. The Bible is clear. In daily life none may claim "infallibility", but as we see, when at the time that same fallible human being speaks "in the name of the Lord", it must be true, for God has spoken and who would judge Him so unjust as to lay truth and error in the same books, right alongside each other?
She is to be judged by the same ruler as all the Biblical messengers (prophets), for such they and she also have claimed to be -- one coming in the name of the Lord. The problem though, is not necessarily with their giving of the message, but with our reception of it. Jesus had the same problem in His day; and in His own town especially.
Mat. 13:57 "And they were offended in him. But Jesus said unto them, A prophet is not without honour, save in his own country, and in his own house."
And did He not give warning also to those who would reject any truth (or messenger of truth), sent by His Spirit?
Mat. 12:31, 32 "Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men. And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come." [See 22-33 KJV.]
"When the Testimonies, which were once believed, are doubted and given up, Satan knows the deceived ones will not stop at this; and he redoubles his efforts till he launches them into open rebellion, which becomes incurable and ends in destruction." [VOL. 4, P. 211; VOL. 1, P. 236] "By giving place to doubts and unbelief in regard to the work of God, and by cherishing feelings of distrust and cruel jealousies, they are preparing themselves for complete deception. They rise up with bitter feelings against the ones who dare to speak of their errors and reprove their sins." [VOL. 3, P. 328.] {5T 672.1}"
"I was shown that many had so little spirituality that they did not understand the value of the Testimonies or their real object. They talked flippantly of the Testimonies given by God for the benefit of His people, and passed judgment upon them, giving their opinion and criticizing this and that, when they would better have placed their hands upon their lips, and prostrated themselves in the dust; for they could not appreciate the spirit of the Testimonies, because they knew so little of the Spirit of God. [VOL. 4, P. 443.] {5T 672.3}"
"If you lose confidence in the Testimonies you will drift away from Bible truth. I have been fearful that many would take a questioning, doubting position, and in my distress for your souls I would warn you. How many will heed the warning? As you now hold the Testimonies, should one be given crossing your track, correcting your errors, would you feel at perfect liberty to accept or reject any part or the whole? That which you will be least inclined to receive is the very part most needed." [VOL. 5, P. 98 (1882).] {5T 674.2}"
Here are some clear and very important statements from her, that pertain to the subject at hand.
"Very many feel impatient and jealous because they are frequently disturbed with warnings and reproofs which keep their sins before them. Says the True Witness: "I know thy works." The motives, the purposes, the unbelief, the suspicions and jealousies may be hid from men, but not from Christ.
The True Witness comes as a counselor: "I counsel thee to buy of Me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see. As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten; be zealous therefore, and repent. Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear My voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with Me. To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with Me in My throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with My Father in His throne." {3T 256.3}
Those who are reproved by the Spirit of God should not rise up against the humble instrument. It is God, and not an erring mortal, who has spoken to save them from ruin.
The True Witness declares that when you suppose you are really in a good condition of prosperity you are in need of everything." (3T 257).
" Those who will not act when the Lord calls upon them, but who wait for more certain evidence and more favorable opportunities, will walk in darkness, for the light will be withdrawn. The evidence given one day, if rejected, may never be repeated. {3T 258.3}"
" Some will not receive the testimony that God has given us to bear, flattering themselves that we may be deceived and that they may be right. They think that the people of God are not in need of plain dealing and of reproof, but that God is with them. These tempted ones, whose souls have ever been at war with the faithful reproving of sin, would cry: Speak unto us smooth things. What disposition will these make of the message of the True Witness to the Laodiceans? There can be no deception here. This message must be borne to a lukewarm church by God's servants. It must arouse His people from their security and dangerous deception in regard to their real standing before God. This testimony, if received, will arouse to action and lead to self-abasement and confession of sins. The True Witness says: "I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot." And again, "As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent." Then comes the promise: "Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear My voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with Me." "To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with Me in My throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with My Father in His throne." {3T 259.1}
The people of God must see their wrongs and arouse to zealous repentance and a putting away of those sins which have brought them into such a deplorable condition of poverty, blindness, wretchedness, and fearful deception. I was shown that the pointed testimony must live in the church. This alone will answer to the message to the Laodiceans. Wrongs must be reproved, sin must be called sin, and iniquity must be met promptly and decidedly, and put away from us as a people. {3T 260.1}"
"They take it for granted that because we have human weaknesses it is a positive evidence that we are wrong and that they are right. If they can find a semblance of anything that they can use to injure us they do it with a spirit of triumph and are ready to denounce our work of reproving wrong and condemning sin as a harsh, dictatorial spirit. {3T 260.2}
"{3T 261.1} Those whom God has chosen for an important work have ever been received with distrust and suspicion."
"{3T 265.1}The prejudice which has arisen against us because we have reproved the wrongs that God has shown me existed, and the cry that has been raised of harshness and severity, are unjust. God bids us speak, and we will not be silent. If wrongs are apparent among His people, and if the servants of God pass on indifferent to them, they virtually sustain and justify the sinner, and are alike guilty and will just as surely receive the displeasure of God; for they will be made responsible for the sins of the guilty.....The task was not agreeable to their feelings; therefore they avoided it. {3T 265.2}"
"{3T 266.1)The true people of God, who have the spirit of the work of the Lord and the salvation of souls at heart, will ever view sin in its real, sinful character. They will always be on the side of faithful and plain dealing with sins which easily beset the people of God. Especially in the closing work for the church, in the sealing time of the one hundred and forty-four thousand who are to stand without fault before the throne of God, will they feel most deeply the wrongs of God's professed people. This is forcibly set forth by the prophet's illustration of the last work under the figure of the men each having a slaughter weapon in his hand. "
"Those who receive the pure mark of truth, wrought in them by the power of the Holy Ghost, represented by a mark by the man in linen, are those "that sigh and that cry for all the abominations that be done" in the church. Their love for purity and the honor and glory of God is such, and they have so clear a view of the exceeding sinfulness of sin, that they are represented as being in agony, even sighing and crying. Read the ninth chapter of Ezekiel. {3T 267.1}"
"{3T 267.2} In the case of Achan's sin God said to Joshua: "Neither will I be with you any more, except ye destroy the accursed from among you." How does this instance compare with the course pursued by those who will not raise their voice against sin and wrong, but whose sympathies are ever found with those who trouble the camp of Israel with their sins? Said God to Joshua: "Thou canst not stand before thine enemies, until ye take away the accursed thing from among you."
"God's displeasure is upon His people, and He will not manifest His power in the midst of them while sins exist among them and are fostered by those in responsible positions. {3T 270.2}"
Brother, if we are doing wrong, do not know it, and cannot enter into a sinless heaven doing so, it is a merciful God that would warn us in time that we may choose to have something done about our problem in the specific detail pointed out. He is just and good then, and the warnings given over a lifetime, will prove the case for Him, and against those that set aside the warnings.
"Either make the tree good, and his fruit good; or else make the tree corrupt, and his fruit corrupt: for the tree is known by his fruit."
"God is either teaching His church, reproving their wrongs and strengthening their faith, or He is not. This work is of God, or it is not. God does nothing in partnership with Satan. My work . . . bears the stamp of God or the stamp of the enemy. There is no halfway work in the matter. The Testimonies are of the Spirit of God, or of the devil." [VOL. 4, P. 230.] {5T 671.2}
As the Lord has manifested Himself through the spirit of prophecy, past, present, and future have passed before me. I have been shown faces that I had never seen, and years afterward I knew them when I saw them. I have been aroused from my sleep with a vivid sense of subjects previously presented to my mind; and I have written, at midnight, letters that have gone across the continent and, arriving at a crisis, have saved great disaster to the cause of God. This has been my work for many years. A power has impelled me to reprove and rebuke wrongs that I had not thought of. Is this work of the last thirty-six years from above or from beneath?" [VOL. 5, PP. 64, 65 (1882).] {5T 671.3}"
"One thing is certain: Those Seventh-day Adventists who take their stand under Satan's banner will first give up their faith in the warnings and reproofs contained in the testimonies of God's Spirit.--Lt 156, 1903. {PM 360.1}
If you lose confidence in the Testimonies you will drift away from Bible truth.--5T 674. {PM 360.2}
Some who are not willing to receive the light, but who prefer to walk in ways of their own choosing, will search the testimonies to find something in them to encourage the spirit of unbelief and disobedience. Thus a spirit of disunion will be brought in; for the spirit which leads them to criticize the testimonies will also lead them to watch their brethren to find in them something to condemn.... {PM 360.3}
Satan is ... constantly pressing in the spurious--to lead away from the truth. The very last deception of Satan will be to make of none effect the testimony of the Spirit of God. "Where there is no vision, the people perish" (Prov. 29:18). Satan will work ingeniously, in different ways and through different agencies, to unsettle the confidence of God's remnant people in the true testimony.... {PM 360.4}
There will be a hatred kindled against the testimonies which is satanic. The workings of Satan will be to unsettle the faith of the churches in them, for this reason: Satan cannot have so clear a track to bring in his deceptions and bind up souls in his delusions if the warnings and reproofs and counsels of the Spirit of God are heeded.--1SM 48. (See 5T 675, 676.) {PM 361.1}"
" I know your danger. If you lose confidence in the testimonies you will drift away from Bible truth. I have been fearful that many would take a questioning, doubting position, and in my distress for your souls I would warn you. How many will heed the warning? As you now hold the testimonies, should one be given crossing your track, correcting your errors, would you feel at perfect liberty to accept or reject any part or the whole? That which you will be least inclined to receive is the very part most needed. God and Satan never work in copartnership. The testimonies either bear the signet of God or that of Satan. A good tree cannot bring forth corrupt fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. By their fruit ye shall know them. God has spoken. Who has trembled at His word? "
As both she and our Lord state then in relation to the messenger and his/her message: it is all or none. It is either true or false. Take it all or leave it. Isa. 8:20 KJV.