SDA
Internet Group Therapy—Session #5
A
Rebuttal to Ulicia Ulrike Unruh
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Ulicia, My responses are interspersed within your
post below: ----- Original Message -----
Ron responds: This fact works against you
Ulicia. Why? Because: · It is true that the church was first
Laodicean in the 1850's. Why use that as an excuse for the church being
Laodicean in 2007? · Ellen White said that if the church
became Laodicean, it would be no more in God's favor than the fallen churches
of Babylon. Let's be reasonable Ulicia and come to reason together on this
point. I believe Ellen White meant that if the church remained and ended up
Laodicean, it would not be in the favor of God any more than the fallen
churches of Babylon. Can you agree with that? · Is the fact that the church was Laodicean
in 1852, any excuse for it being Laodicean in 2007? · The church had never committed the omega
apostasies in the 1850's that it has committed since the 1930's. So I must
consider your point skewed and moot. What are you trying to prove considering
these facts? End Ron's comment. Ron responds: · The most colossal twisting of Ellen
White’s statements that I have incurred in my 65 years as a Seventh-day Adventist
is your interpretation that Ellen White said that the church would NEVER
become a sister to fallen Babylon, or any part of Babylon. That is one of the
biggest lies attributed to Ellen G. White by any member of the church. She
said just the opposite. She said how the church could become part of Babylon. · It is not true that my warning message is
the same as used by Stanton and Caldwell. Why? How? Because the church had
not committed any of the apostasies I deal in except its continued walk in
the Laodicean state. · The church had not formed a New Movement
that removed God, and that would allow nothing to stand in its way. 1SM
204-5. · The church had not imbibed the omega of
apostasy, which would wax stronger until Jesus comes. · The church had not imbibed the omega
which was to be far worse than the alpha. · The church leaders had not stated that
the nature of Christ was like Adam BEFORE the fall. · The church leaders had not joined
Babylon's associations, councils and confederacies. · The church leaders had not adopted
Babylon's Satanic Celebration mode of worship, whereby there has been loud
hard rock music at SDA campmeetings. Ellen White prophesied that this would
transpire in the church's campmeetings just before the close of probation,
and it has come true. There is a well produced video by an SDA engineer, Kirk
Weedman, who is a MEMBER of the church, demonstrating such uncouth and
Satanic goings on. · The church was not KNOWINGLY teaching two
different gospels to the world. · The church was not going to Babylon in
search of the Holy Spirit. · The church was not educating its
ministers in Eriksonian Hypnosis techniques via Neuro-Linguistic Programming,
so as to be able to control the members when the "GREAT CHANGES"
came along. Then Canadian Conference President Doug Devnich said in the Canadian Messenger in the latter
1980's that "great changes" were coming. And so they have. NLP
techniques have been quite effective in controlling the members of the
church. · The church had not instituted home
"cell groups," which forbid "controversial" topics. · The church had not praised the pope by
giving him a gold medallion and bowing to Him and calling him "His
Holiness." · Church leaders had not questioned the 7
day creation week, thus casting doubt on the verity of Scripture and the
plain Word of God. · Church leaders had not instructed SDA's
in two different countries of the world, Korea and Russia, to send their
children to school on the Holy Seventh-day Sabbath. See Alph Lohne's book on
Russia. Ask Bryan Bissell about the situation in Korea. Is that KEEPING the
commandments of God? · The church had not adopted the Trinity
doctrine which disagrees with Ellen White's rendition of the Godhead. · The church had not adopted the
Accreditation Standards of the world, thus marrying the church's youth to the
world. There could be no better master plan to do so by Satan himself! · The church had not written a book
praising Babylon such as George Vandeman's book does. What is Ellen White's
instruction when the church praises the wicked? "'They that forsake the
law praise the wicked.' Proverbs 28:4. When those who are uniting with the
world, yet claiming great purity, plead for union with those who have ever
been the opposers of the cause of truth, we should fear and shun them as
decidedly as did Nehemiah. Such counsel is prompted by the enemy of all good.
It is the speech of timeservers, and should be resisted as resolutely today
as then. Whatever influence would tend to unsettle the faith of God' people
in His guiding power, should be steadfastly withstood." E.G. White,
Prophets and Kings, p. 660. · No General Conference President had ever
stood before a federal court, to give the sworn testimony that what SDA's
once taught about the Catholics had now been "consigned to the
traditional trash heap." This was a total betrayal of the three angel's
messages. The church is corporately response for this treason against God
until it should make due repentance for that act. · Ellen White said that we do not know the
worst abominations, 5T 211. "The plain straight testimony must
live in the church, or the curse of God will rest upon His people as surely
as it did upon ancient Israel because of their sins. God holds His people, as
a body [corporately], responsible for the sins existing in individuals among
them." Testimonies, vol. 3, p.
269. Ulicia, I don't find that you and your
leaders are concerned about the above abominations. I don't find that you
sigh and cry about them. Thus, I find rather a peace and safety stance on
your part concerning these issues. Are they mere criticisms or serious
violations of serious truths commissioned to the SDA church? If all of the above are mere criticisms,
what do you sigh and cry about? What does your husband sigh and cry about?
End Ron's comment. But just like those men back then with
their "satanic" (and Ellen White calls it that) message, who took the warnings and reproves and
twisted them to mean the church is Babylon and were calling people out, you
have done the same thing. Ron responds: 1. I have done much study and I realize that
some false positions were held on the part of some, including leadership in
the 1880's and especially onward. 2. Do the errors of the past excuse
forbidden disobedience to God's commands in the future? 3. Did the errors taught in the past involve
violation of the Midnight Cry and the first and second angel's messages? Will
you answer these questions? 4. Did the errors of the past involve
liaison with Babylon in violation of Isaiah 8:9-14, the Midnight Cry and the
first and second angel's messages? Ron's response: · I don't believe the church is Babylon. I
believe Roman Catholicism Babylon. She had daughters who are sisters. Ellen
White said how the church could become a sister to fallen Babylon. I see that
the church has not cleansed the camp of the licentiousness and unlawful
intimacy that Ellen White referred to in the following statement. I find that
the condition has grown worse to the point where the church admits that it
has a similar divorce rate as the world percentage-wise. An SDA conference
president here in Canada, married his daughter to a Catholic in the SDA
church. A conference president had an affair with his secretary and was then
moved to a southern conference in the U.S.A. This is just an example as to
how licentious pastors have been shuffled from one conference to another when
committing adultery IF THEY WERE GOOD SALESMEN! How do I twist the following
statement? How do I twist any statement I use. Please give me examples as you
are responsible for doing so. No genuine Christian would make such serious
charges without proof. · "We
must as a people arouse and cleanse the camp of Israel. Licentiousness,
unlawful intimacy, and unholy practices are coming in among us in a large
degree...We are in danger of becoming a sister to fallen Babylon, of allowing
our churches to become corrupted and filled with every foul spirit, a cage
for every unclean and hateful bird, and will we be clear unless we make
decided movements to cure the existing evil? E. G. White, Manuscript Releases No. 449, pp. 17, 18. · Ellen White
gave simple statements defining how the church could become the cage of every
unclean and hateful bird. Those statements find glaring fulfillment to many
reformers such as Dr. John Grosboll and Dr. Ralph Larson. How is it that you
cannot discern the fulfillment of those plain and simple statements when the
fulfillment is just as plain and simple to see? · Do you
consider Dr. John Grosboll and Dr. Ralph Larson as being satanic? Do you
believe they have twisted Ellen White and Scripture? They teach that the
church has committed unpardonable sin apostasy. End Ron's comments. "Those
who have proclaimed the Seventh-day Adventist Church as Babylon, have made
use of the Testimonies in giving their position a seeming support; but why is
it that they did not present that which for years has been the burden of my
message--the unity of the church? Why did they not quote the words of the
angel, "Press together, press together, press together"? Why did
they not repeat the admonition and state the principle, that "in union
there is strength, in division there is weakness"? It is such messages
as these men have borne that divide the church, and put us to shame before
the enemies of truth; and in such messages is plainly revealed the specious
working of the great deceiver, who would hinder the church from attaining
unto perfection in unity. These teachers follow the sparks of their own
kindling, move according to their own independent judgment, and cumber the
truth with false notions and theories. They refuse the counsel of their
brethren, and press on in their own way until they become just what Satan would
desire to have them--unbalanced in mind. {TM 56.1} Ron responds:
Ulicia, you have chosen to ignore the counsel of the True Witness to the
church by not including all of the testimony as to when we are to press
together and when not to do so. Why you make that choice I do not know. I do
know it is not because you are ignorant of all of the statements, so you have
chosen what you wish above the clear testimony as to our course when error is
present in the church. Ellen White
says that we should not be in unity with error, that it is preferable to have
war. God and Ellen White say that it is impossible to unite with the corrupt
and remain pure. The SDA Bible Commentary says it is impossible
for the wheat to mature amongst open sinners in the camp. I submit to
you Ulicia Unruh, that it is the leaders who have divided the church. Is it because
it would jeopardize your husbands position as a minister if you 16For
the leaders of this people cause them to err; and they that are led
of them are destroyed. 17Therefore
the Lord shall have no joy in
their young men, neither shall have mercy on their fatherless and
widows: for every one is an hypocrite and an evildoer, and every mouth speaketh folly. For
all this his anger is not turned away, but his hand is stretched out still. 18For wickedness burneth as
the fire: it shall devour the briers and thorns, and shall kindle in the thickets of the forest, and
they shall mount up like the lifting up of smoke. 19 Through the wrath of the LORD of hosts is
the land darkened, and the people shall be as the fuel of
the fire: no man shall spare his
brother. 20 And he shall snatch on the right hand, and be hungry; and
he shall eat on the left hand, and they shall not be satisfied: they
shall eat every man the flesh of his own arm: 21 Manasseh, Ephraim;
and Ephraim, Manasseh: and they together shall be against Judah. For
all this his anger is not turned away, but his hand is stretched out still. End Ron’s
comment. Ron responds: The most pervasive and
comprehensive study of 1888 I know of has been conducted by Laval Piccard who
was once a minister of your church Ulicia. I have copied two of his booklets
onto my Website and will do the others imminently. Also, in 1987, I purchased
all of Jones and Waggoner’s books on the 1888 message from Leaves of Autumn
books in Arizona, for my church group. We have studied those messages. Concerning Operation Global Rain, I
believe that any sign that your church members are waking up will include a
demand for changes in all of the violations of the Word of God that I mention
in this document. I believe those demands will be met with scourgings from
the SDA synagogues of all who make such demands by way of protesting error.
Why will the faithful receivers of any global rain manifestation of the Holy
Spirit be ousted from your church as has already happened in thousands of
cases around the world? Because Ellen White said that “nothing would be
allowed to stand in the way of the new movement.” I believe her prophesy. I
believe her prophesy that the omega of apostasy would surely develop and wax
stronger until Jesus comes. Do you believe her on these statements Ulicia? Do
you? So I don’t believe Global Rain will be a
total failure. The wise virgins will awaken to what is going on and that a
new movement has supplanted the church we once knew as the SDA church. Even
Dr. George R. Knight, an Andrews University professor, admits that the
pioneers would not join the church as it believes today. I believe Ellen
White would not be a member of the church as it stands today. I truly believe
that. End Ron’s comment. Ron responds: I don’t find that Ellen
White said that the church would never, under any circumstance become a
sister to fallen Babylon and the cage of every unclean and hateful bird. I
find just the opposite. I find it is you who has totally twisted Ellen White
on that issue. I find that you totally misrepresent and twist some of her
statements on Babylon in order to make it “appear” that she said the church
could never, under any circumstances, become a sister to fallen Babylon. That
is not honest. That is not integral. That is purely dishonest twisting and
misrepresentation of the truth of the issue. I don’t pick just the reproofs. I pick on
the admonitions of God’s Word. Ellen White and Scripture make it very clear
that nothing is going to scatter and/or dissolve your apostate church until
it is broken in pieces in a literal fulfillment of Ezekiel 9 at judgment
time. You don’t have to worry about that. That is not my mission to dissolve
or break in pieces your apostate church. Your leaders are doing a tremendous
job of doing exactly that. Entire churches have left the conference as a
result of the Satanic Celebration movement, but you don’t seem the least
concerned about that? Why? Why? Why? The leaders have done more to divide and
disunify the church than any outside reformer faction. Please wake up to that
fact in your Operation Global Rain pursuit. As far as another coming out is
concerned, even if Ellen White did not give conditions for another coming
out, which she certainly does, the Bible does as well. Ezekiel 5:1-3 is
another coming out. Ezekiel 9 is another and Ezekiel 22:17-31 is an
irrefutably conclusive Bible proof of another coming out. Then there is
Isaiah 4:1-4 and 37:31, 32, which cannot be mistaken by any person who is ever
blessed with any global rain outpouring of the Holy Spirit. Isaiah 9:16
demands another coming out as well. Men, maidens and little children who
reject this truth, will all perish together as they did in the type of A.D.
70. See Testimonies, Vol. 5, p.
211. This demands another coming out AT THE END TIME. These references cannot
be twisted by anyone and they are clear-cut to any discerning disciple of the
Word. Any true recipient of any manifestation of Operation Global Rain will
come to this light. End Ron’s comment. “God desires us to awake from our
slumbers. He desires us to do our duty. He desires to endue us with His
Spirit and lift us up onto a higher platform. Everyone who will come into
line will understand Ron’s response: I truly believe the
sentence: “Everyone who will come into
line will understand what the will of God is.” But you better understand
what “coming into line” means. It means heeding all of the Word of God which
is made manifest by obedience to all His commands. It means buying gold tried
in the fire which is faith that works by love and which is made manifest in
obedience to all the commands of God. I do not follow my own choosing. Ellen
White said it is the church members who follow their own choosing. If I did,
I would not choose to incur the calumny I encounter by telling the truth.
Your position avoids that calumny and the cross it involves. Your position is
thus one of peach and safety—all is well, and Ellen White said that God’s people
love such admonitions. She said that your leaders prophesy falsely and that
you love it! COUNTERPART: "The
Lord commanded one of his ancient servants, 'Pray not thou for this people
[Jer. 7:16 and 11:14], neither lift up cry nor prayer for them neither make
intercession to me for I will not hear thee.' The prophet thus describes the
sins which had called forth this fearful denunciation: 'The prophets [leaders] prophesy falsely, and the priests bear rule
by their means and my people love to have it so and what will ye do in
the end thereof?' 'From the least of them even unto the greatest of them,
every one is given to covetousness and from the prophet even unto the priest,
every one dealeth falsely. They have healed also the hurt of the daughter of
my people slightly, saying, Peace, peace, when there is no peace.' The
apostles declare that this state of things will find its COUNTERPART in the
last days. Many have a form of godliness, but in their daily life deny the
power thereof. They have ceased to be convicted of their sins or alarmed at
their state. They say in their hearts, 'The church is flourishing. Peace and
spiritual prosperity are within her borders.' The words of the prophet may well
apply to these self-deceivers, 'They
have chosen their own ways, and their soul delighteth in their
abominations. I also will choose their delusions, and will bring their fears
upon them." E. G. White, Second
Advent Review and Sabbath Herald, 11-07-82. Sincerely in loving but
stern warning, Ron Beaulieu ----- Original Message ----- When the errors are repudiated it is
termed criticism and accusing of the brethren! Ulicia never tells us how the church
could imbibe “every uncouth thing” in its Campmeetings “just before the close
of probation,” and still go through to the sea of glass by becoming the
church triumphant. "The church is in the Laodicean
state. The presence of God is not in her midst." E.G. White, Notebook Leaflets, p. 99, 1898. Ron’s Commentary: If the context suggests
in any way that Christ’s presence is in the church, then Ellen White
contradicted herself, but she does not. It is these types of comments that
make dealing with God’s people most tedious. The context gives qualifying
words by which the church could restore the presence of God.
Ron’s Commentary: The person who wrote
the above quote did not highlight and underline it. I did. He thought I was
taking Ellen White quote that says God’s presence was not in the church out
of context. But the highlighted words above QUALIFY the conditions for the
church retaining the presence of God. The person in question is forever
missing the qualifying passages. My
Open Challenge to Ulicia Unruh |