God’s Organized Body—

Who is it? What is it? Where is it?

When is it? And Why is it? Where is the Porch and the Altar Today?

Joel 2:17 Let the priests, the ministers of the LORD, weep between the porch and the altar, and let them say, Spare thy people, O LORD, and give not thine heritage to reproach, that the heathen should rule over them: wherefore should they say among the people, Where [is] their God? 

“'Where two or three are gathered together in My name, there am I in the midst of them.' Where Christ is even among the humble few, THIS IS CHRIST'S CHURCH, for the presence of the High and Holy One who inhabiteth eternity can alone constitute a church." Upward Look, p. 315.

"The warning for the last church [Laodicea] also must be proclaimed to all who claim to be Christians. The Laodicean message, like a sharp, two--edged sword, must go to ALL THE CHURCHES:... It is our work to proclaim this message. Are we putting forth every effort that the churches may be warned?" Testimonies, vol. 6, p. 77.




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I promise you in the name of the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, that any professing Seventh-day Adventist who carefully and prayerfully reads this document will be in for the shock of his/her life as a Seventh-day Adventist. If I had the means, I would give every Seventh-day Adventist in the world $100 or more to read this document. I would give them another $100 to any who tried to refute it! I would/will publish on my Website, the rebuttal of any professing Seventh-day Adventist who thinks he/she can refute the weight of evidence in this document. That is as fair, just, and honest as anyone could be.

As of 2011, Adventists have been an entity on the earth for 167 years. Would you agree that it is about time Adventist learn WHO, WHAT, WHERE, WHEN AND WHY God’s organized body is? I will tell you of  a truth friend that to this day, Adventists still have a wrong conception of God’s organized body and that wrong conception will be the reason most Adventists will lose out on eternal life. Because this is true, this issue is of extreme unction to God’s people the world over.


In one short, easy to understand statement, Ellen White defined God’s church and what it IS NOT. Please carefully and prayerfully note:


"God has a church. It is not the great cathedral, neither is it the national establishment, neither is it the various denominations; it is the people who love God and keep His commandments. 'Where two or three are gathered together in My name, there am I in the midst of them.' Where Christ is even among the humble few, THIS IS CHRIST'S CHURCH, for the presence of the High and Holy One who inhabiteth eternity can alone constitute a church." Upward Look, p. 315.


·       God indeed has a church. That is the subject.

·       God’s church is not the great cathedral or the mega churches.

·       It is not any national establishment established by any nation such as the Anglican church established by the nation of Great Britain.

·       And most importantly—for Seventh-day Adventists, IT IS NOT THE VARIOUS DENOMINATIONS! Is professing Seventh-day Adventism an organized denomination since 1863? Oh yes indeed it is! It that DENOMINATION God’s church? NO! NO! NO! Not if you believe its prophetess Ellen Gould White.


Thus far we have learned WHAT God’s church IS NOT. Now we will review WHO, WHAT,



·       God’s church (organized body) is the people who love God and KEEP His commandments.

·       WHERE two or three are gathered together in My name, there God is in the midst of them.' If Jesus is with one other person, is that TWO gathered together? Ellen White says that Jesus would have died for any ONE person on earth. WOULD JESUS AND THAT ONE PERSON have constituted His church on earth? WHERE Christ is, even among any humble few who love Him and KEEP His commandments, this is Christ’s church, His organized body.

·       WHO, WHAT, WHERE, WHEN AND HOW is a church constituted? Only God’s PRESENCE can constitute a church. When His presence is amongst any who love Him and KEEP His commandments, that is God’s organized body, HIS CHURCH.


Some, like Walter Veith and his followers, as well as the highest leaders in the SDA professing new movement church (1SM 204-205) believe very sincerely that Laodicean is the final church of God because it is the 7th and last church mentioned in Revelation chapters 2 and 3. Is that a true belief or it is purely a fallacious lie, that if trusted, will result in the loss of most professing Seventh-day Adventists? Let’s have a further look at Laodicea as defined by a woman Seventh-day Adventists PRETEND to accept as their prophetess, while MOST really don’t believe much of what she says at all.


"The church is in the Laodicean condition. The presence of God in not in her midst." Notebook Leaflets, p. 99.


Let’s carefully, prayerfully consider some important facts about Laodicea:


·       God gave us a licence to come together and reason by instructing us to do exactly that.

·       Ellen White said that the 7th and final church is in the Laodicean (lukewarm) condition and that the presence of God is not in her midst’s.

·       Ellen White said that only the presence of God can constitute a church. So is Laodicea a church?

·       Laodicea does not qualify as a church unless God’s presence is found in her?

·       What is Laodicea when God’s presence is not found in her? It is the Synagogue of Satan.

·       Did Ellen White say Satan entered Laodicea a many decades ago?

·       “PH086 - Special Testimony to Battle Creek Church (1898)

·       The Lord Jesus demands that every soul make a reality of truth. Show that you believe that you are not half with Christ and half with the world. Of all such Christ says, "I would thou wert cold or hot. So then, because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spew thee out of my mouth." He who appreciates the love of Christ, will be an earnest worker with Christ to bring other souls as sheaves to the Master. Thorough work is always done by all who are connected with Christ. They bear fruit to his glory. But indolence and carelessness and frivolity separate the soul from Christ, and Satan comes in to work his will with the poor worldly subject, We have a great truth, but through careless indifference the truth has lost its force upon us. Satan has come in with his specious temptations, and has led the professed followers of Christ away from their Leader, classing them with the foolish virgins. {PH086 23.2}


·       So 113 years ago, in 1893, Satan entered the professing SDA church and it became classed with the foolish virgins?

·       Has the professing SDA church become better or worse since 1898? Was the church to get better or worse? Was apostasy to cease or wax stronger?

·       Wax stronger "One thing it is certain is soon to be realized, the great apostasy, which is developing and increasing and waxing stronger, and will continue to do so until the Lord shall descend from heaven with a shout. We are to hold fast the first principles of our denominated faith, and go forward from strength to increased faith. Ever we are to keep the faith that has been substantiated by the Holy Spirit of God from the earlier events of our experience until the present time. We need now larger breadth, and deeper, more earnest, unwavering faith in the leadings of the Holy Spirit. If we needed the manifest proof of the Holy Spirit's power to confirm truth in the beginning, after the passing of the time, we need to-day all the evidence in the confirmation of the truth, when souls are departing from the faith and giving heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of devils. There must not be any languishing of soul now." (E.G. White, Special Testimonies, Series B, No. 7, p. 57).

“I am charged to tell our people that some do not realize that the devil has device after device that he carries out in ways that make sinners out of saints. I tell you now, that when I am laid to rest great changes will take place.” Elmshaven, February 24, 1915. Unpublished testimony of Ellen G. White. February 24, 1915. http://www.theoriginalpath.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/When-I-Am-Laid-To-Rest.pdf [It is not difficult to understand why this statement is an “unpublished” statement!]

·       Great changes after Ellen White’s death:  “I am charged to tell our people, that do not realize, that the devil has device after device, and he carries them out in ways that they do not expect.  Satan’s agencies will invent ways to make sinners out of saints.  I tell you now, that when I am laid to rest GREAT CHANGES will take place.  I do not know when I shall be taken; and I desire to warn all against the devices of the devil.  I want the people to know that I warned them fully before my death.”  E.G. White, Manuscript 1, February 24, 1915.

·       The above statement no longer appears at the Ellen G. White Complete Works at this link: https://egwwritings.org/ It appears in the works of the following SDA Ministers: Robert J. Wieland and Donald K. Shorts 1888 Examined, and the following work by Vance Ferrell:

·       I tell you now, that when I am laid to rest, great changes will take place.... I want the people to know that I warned them fully before my death. Manuscript 1, February 24, 1915. Quoted by Vance Ferrell at this link: http://www.sdadefend.com/MINDEX-Resource%20Library/Last-Day-Events.pdf

·       1888 Examined, Robert J. Wieland and Donald K. Short: http://www.gospel-herald.com/wieland/1888re_ex/rx_chapter_12.htm

·       Can God hold it against ANY true SDA for believing Ellen White’s final statement to the church in 1915, that when she died, great changes would take place in the church and Satan would continue to make sinners of saints. Does this sound like a change for the better since the 1898 entrance of Satan into the church and classed it with the foolish virgins?

·       Are foolish virgins saved? Can a foolish virgin “church” SEAL and SAVE YOU? Can any denomination SEAL and SAVE you? Not that I know of!

·       Is a foolish virgin “church” the “Jerusalem” we are SEALED BY AND IN?

·       Is a foolish virgin Synagogue of Satan (because he entered and took over) where the porch and the altar is wherein we are to weep between?

·       Have SDA leaders, including Dr. Walter Veith, errantly instructed us that the porch and the altar between which we are to weep for God’s people, resides in the foolish virgin Synagogue of Satan?

·       Ellen White said that ALL the ancient prophets wrote more for us than the Jews. Does this UPDATE Isaiah 56:10-12 to NOW? Is Walter Veith excluded from these verses when they include ALL the watchmen THREE TIMES? Is Roger Morneau excluded from these verses? Is any “watchman” who is a member of the foolish virgin Synagogue of Satan which has removed God, (1SM 205), excluded from Isaiah 56:10-12? Can God EVER fault us for believing such serious instruction as Isaiah 56:10-12, JUST AS IT READS, when Ellen White says that all who don’t take the Word “just as it reads will be taken in a snare?”

·       Are most SDA’s today taken in a snare because they refuse to update the sayings of all the ancient prophets to NOW?

·       Would the Bible be a far more exciting and compelling Book to EVERYONE, and so importantly OUR YOUTH, if every Seventh-day Adventists would UPDATE its sayings to NOW?

·       Does Dr. Walter Veith and ALL other SDA leaders who are members of the new movement Satan has formed “among” (within) believe Isaiah 56:10-12 applies to them? Not that I know of!

·       Does Ellen White reapply Isaiah 56:10-12 in Testimonies, Vol. 5, 211, to NOW, wherein she mentions the “dumb-dogs” who will NEVER AGAIN show the House of Jacob its sins?

·       Is Babylon the House of Jacob?”

·       Is Babylon those who have been “privileged with great light?”

·       SDA leaders say in the compilation book Last Day Events, that Ellen White made only ONE STATEMENT that expressed a loss of confidence in the SDA church. That is far from true as the document at this link proves: https://omega77.tripod.com/leavestate.htm

·       The above statement was made in 1915, the same year Ellen White died. She died July 16, 1915. So just five months before Ellen White died, she said that God charged her to tell professing Seventh-day Adventists that the devil would make sinners out of saints and that great changes would take place when she was laid to rest. And she said the apostasy would wax stronger. Some of us KNOW that is EXACTLY what has happened.

·       Is cold apostasy a lukewarm state? Not that I know of!

·       Can Laodicea be God’s organized church if God’s presence is not in her midsts?

·       Can God hold ANYONE responsible for believing Ellen G. White’s statements that only Christ’s presence can constitute a church and that His presence in not in Laodicea’s midst?

·       Does God and His prophetess speak with a forked-tongue on this issue so that we cannot be sure of what either means on this all important issue of defining His church? I would not think so, since God instructs us to let our conversation be YEA or NAY and that all in-between is of Satan.


Let’s carefully, prayerfully, study more about Laodicea, to wit:


"The state of the Church represented by the foolish virgins, is also spoken of as the Laodicean state." E. G. White,  Review and Herald Articles,  Vol. 2, 420, 8/19/1890. 




·       If Laodicea is the foolish virgin state of the church, and all who remain in that state are lost, how is Laodicea the final church?

·       When one heeds the counsel of the True Witness in the message to Laodicea, Revelation 3, is he/she still classed as a Laodicean (lukewarm or cold apostate)?

Did Ellen White call ALL CHURCHES in the world Laodicean? Did she say that the Laodicea message applied to ALL OF THEM? Please carefully and prayerfully note: "The warning for the last church [Laodicea] also must be proclaimed to all who claim to be Christians. The Laodicean message, like a sharp, two--edged sword, must go to ALL THE CHURCHES:...It is our work to proclaim this message. Are we putting forth every effort that the churches may be warned?" Testimonies, vol. 6, p. 77.


·       If Loadicea is the 7th and final church and applies ONLY TO THE SDA CHURCH, as ALL SDA LEADERS ERRANTLY TEACH, including Dr. Walter Veith, how is it that Ellen White applied Laodicea to ALL THE CHURCHES—TO ALL WHO CLAIM TO BE CHRISTIANS? Count the number of denominations who claim to be Christian. AND while you are counting, consider that SDA LEADERS AND LAITY ALIKE, SAY THAT ANY OTHER LAODICEA OTHER THAN SDA LAODICEA WOULD CONSTITUTE AN 8TH CHURCH. Do you see anything wrong with this picture? Do you see PURE DELUSION? Do you see Satanic “device” delusion? If you don’t, you should go into your closet, close the door, and pray until you do see something Satanically wrong with professing SDA’s teaching that Laodicea applies only to them AS THE FINAL AND FAITHFUL CHURCH TRIUMPHANT, and that any other church would be an 8th, 9th, 10th, etc., etc., ad infinitum! How foolish can foolish virgins get?

·       Ellen White said that all the messages to the seven churches of Revelation 2 and 3 apply to the end-time:


 "The names of the seven churches are symbolic of the church in different periods of the Christian Era. The number indicates completeness, and is symbolic of the fact that the messages [plural] extend to the end of time, while the symbols used reveal the condition of the church [collectively and generally] at different periods in the history of the world." E.G. White, The Acts of the Apostles, 585.


Christ’s Object Lessons, pp. 405, 406, mentions three classes amongst two groups.


1.    Class #1: The bride’s house, p. 405. Lingering near the bride’s house (not at it) are ten young virgins.

2.    Class #2: Five wise virgins.

3.    Class #3: Five foolish virgins.


The voice of God and the voice of the bride, awakens all ten virgins and Matthew 25 says they all slumbered and slept.


The bride is distinguished from the 10 virgins whom she awakens. And since there are two groups amongst the ten virgins, this makes 3 classes: The bride, the wise virgins and the foolish virgins. But one could reckon them as only two groups, because the bride are wise virgins as well, but very special bethulah (Hebrew) virgins, Isaiah 62:1-5 who are married, and all other virgins are brides maidens and guests at the wedding. If guests they cannot be the bride and if the bride they cannot be the guests.


"To Meet the Bridegroom"

[This chapter is based on Matt. 25:1-13.]


“Christ with His disciples is seated upon the Mount of Olives. The sun has set behind the mountains, and the heavens are curtained with the shades of evening. In full view is a dwelling house lighted up brilliantly as if for some festive scene. The light streams from the openings, and an expectant company wait around, indicating that a marriage procession is soon to appear. In many parts of the East, wedding festivities are held in the evening. The bridegroom goes forth to meet his bride and bring her to his home. By torchlight the bridal party proceed from her father's house to his own, where a feast is provided for the invited guests. In the scene upon which Christ looks, a company are awaiting the appearance of the bridal party, intending to join the procession.

Lingering near the bride's house are ten young women robed in white. Each carries a lighted lamp and a small flagon for oil. All are anxiously watching for the appearance

Page 406

of the bridegroom. But there is a delay. Hour after hour passes; the watchers become weary and fall asleep. At midnight the cry is heard, "Behold, the bridegroom cometh; go ye out to meet him." The sleepers, suddenly awaking, spring to their feet. They see the procession moving on, bright with torches and glad with music. They hear the voice of the bridegroom and the voice of the bride. The ten maidens seize their lamps and begin to trim them, in haste to go forth. But five have neglected to fill their flasks with oil. They did not anticipate so long a delay, and they have not prepared for the emergency. In distress they appeal to their wiser companions saying, "Give us of your oil; for our lamps are going out." (Margin.) But the waiting five, with their freshly trimmed lamps, have emptied their flagons. They have no oil to spare, and they answer, "Not so; lest there be not enough for us and you: but go ye rather to them that sell, and buy for yourselves."

While they went to buy, the procession moved on, and left them behind. The five with lighted lamps joined the throng and entered the house with the bridal train, and the door was shut. When the foolish virgins reached the banqueting hall, they received an unexpected denial. The master of the feast declared, "I know you not." They were left standing without, in the empty street, in the blackness of the night.

As Christ sat looking upon the party that waited for the bridegroom, He told His disciples the story of the ten virgins, by their experience illustrating the experience of the church that shall live just before His second coming.

The two classes of watchers represent the two classes who profess to be waiting for their Lord. They are called virgins because they profess a pure faith. By the lamps is represented the word of God. The psalmist says, "Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto may path." Christ’s Object Lessons, 405, 406.


"To the end of time, the presence of the Spirit is to abide with the true church." E.G. White, Acts of the Apostles, p. 55.


Another Coming Out: "As reformers they had come out of the denominational churches, but they now act a part similar to that which the churches acted. We hoped that there would not be the necessity for another coming out." Ellen G. White, The Ellen G. White 1888 Materials, Vol. 1, p. 356-7.


Here is what SDA leaders who compiled Last Day Events, say about the above statement. This is one of the most bigoted, lying abominations ever penned by SDA leaders. This is how they fulfill Isaiah 9:16 to lead SDA’s to destruction:


   “I was confirmed in all I had stated in Minneapolis, that a reformation must go through the churches. Reforms must be made, for spiritual weakness and blindness were upon the people who had been blessed with great light and precious opportunities and privileges. As reformers they had come out of the denominational churches, but they now act a part similar to that which the churches acted. We hoped that there would not be the necessity for another coming out. [THIS IS THE ONLY KNOWN STATEMENT FROM THE PEN OF ELLEN WHITE INDICATING THAT SHE MIGHT HAVE LOST CONFIDENCE IN THE SEVENTH-DAY ADVENTIST CHURCH ORGANIZATION. THE DOUBT WHICH SHE EXPRESSED HERE WAS NEVER REPEATED DURING THE REMAINING TWENTY-SIX YEARS OF HER LIFE.] While we will endeavor to keep the "unity of the Spirit" in the bonds of peace, we will not with pen or voice cease to protest against bigotry.”--EGW'88 356, 357 (1889). {LDE 48.1}


SDA leaders add that notation (in caps) to the above statement as it appears in Last Day Events, which is their compilation book of Ellen White statements on the end-time. They say the above statement is the ONLY ONE she ever made that expressed a loss of confidence in the SDA church. That is a diabolical die, for there are many, many statements wherein Ellen White expressed a loss of confidence in the church with the greatest of them all being her prophecy of the final outcome of the church militant, to wit:


"Jesus sends HIS PEOPLE a message of warning to prepare them for his coming. To the prophet John was made known the closing work in the great plan of man's redemption. He beheld an angel flying 'in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people, saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him for the hour of his Judgment is come and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters [Rev. 14:6, 7.].

The angel represented in prophecy as delivering this message,  symbolizes a class of faithful men, who, obedient to the promptings of God's Spirit and the teachings of his word, proclaim this warning to the inhabitants of earth. This message was not to be committed to the religious leaders of the people. They had failed to preserve their connection with God, and had REFUSED THE LIGHT FROM HEAVEN therefore they WERE NOT of the number described by the apostle Paul: 'But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day we are not of the night nor of darkness' [1 Thess. 5:4, 5]. 

The watchmen upon the walls of Zion should be the first to catch the tidings of the Saviour's advent, the first to lift their voices to proclaim him near, the first to warn the people to prepare for his coming. But they were at ease, dreaming of peace and safety, while the people were asleep in their sins. Jesus saw HIS CHURCH, like the barren fig-tree, covered with pretentious leaves, yet destitute of precious fruit. There was a boastful observance of the forms of religion, while the spirit of true humility, penitence and faith--which alone could render the service acceptable to God--was lacking. Instead of the graces of the Spirit, there were manifested pride, formalism, vainglory, selfishness, oppression. A BACKSLIDING CHURCH closed their eyes to the signs of the times. God did nor forsake them, or suffer his faithfulness to fail but they departed from him, and SEPARATED THEMSELVES from his love. As they REFUSED TO COMPLY WITH THE CONDITIONS, his promises were NOT FULFILLED to them."  E.G. White, The Spirit of Prophecy,  vol. 4, pp. 199-200 [The 1884 edition of The Great Controversy, 199, 200].


Ellen White is speaking directly to the people who received the Revelation 14 commission of the three angel’s messages. The church knew the truth and backslid from it. The church refused to comply with the conditions, so God’s promises WERE NOT fulfilled to it. This could not be any plainer.


Are you are aware that the leaders let the 1884 edition of The Great Controversy lapse out of copyright and quit printing it. It was not available for awhile until an SDA Doctor began to reprint it on his own. The General Conference took the Doctor to court to stop the publication of the 1884 edition of the Great Controversy (Spirit of Prophecy, vol. 4), but the Doctor won the case. So the GC began to publish the book once again. God showed me that the reason the GC did not want the book in circulation is because of Ellen White’s statement (pp. 199, 200) above which shows the final outcome of the church.


Combine that statement with Ellen White’s statement that after her death there would be great changes made—implying that Satan’s devices would be employed in the church to make sinners our of saints and many other “loss of confidence” statements by Ellen White about the church, and you will know what liars the leaders are to tell you that the following statement is the only ONE Ellen White ever made that showed a loss of confidence in the church:



Another Coming Out: “I was shown the necessity of those who believe that we are having the last message of mercy, being separate from those who are daily imbibing new errors. I saw that neither young nor old should attend their meetings; for it is wrong to thus encourage them while they teach error that is a deadly poison to the soul and teach for doctrines the commandments of men. The influence of such gatherings is not good. If God has delivered us from such darkness and error, we should stand fast in the liberty wherewith He has set us free and rejoice in the truth. God is displeased with us when we go to listen to error, without being obliged to go; for unless He sends us to those meetings where error is forced home to the people by the power of the will, He will not keep us. The angels cease their watchful care over us, and we are left to the buffetings of the enemy, to be darkened and weakened by him and the power of his evil angels; and the light around us becomes contaminated with the darkness.” {EW 124.3}


"Even though you may not be able to speak a word to those who are working on wrong principles, leave them. Your withdrawal and silence may do more than words. Nehemiah refused to associate with those who were untrue to principle, and he would not permit his workmen to associate with them. The love and fear of God were his safeguard-Dare to be a Daniel, Dare to stand alone. Thus as did Moses, you will endure the seeing of Him who is invisible. But a cowardly and silent reserve before evil associates, while you listen to their devices makes you one with them Come out from among them and be separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you, and will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty." Review & Herald Vol. 4, p. 42.


"If the church of God becomes LUKEWARM [LAODICEAN] it does not stand in favor with God any more than do the churches that are represented as having fallen and become the habitation of devils and the hold of every foul spirit and the cage of every unclean and hateful bird. Those who have had opportunities to hear and receive the truth, and who have united with the Seventh-day Adventist church, calling themselves the commandment keeping people of God, and yet possess no more vitality and consecration to God than do the nominal churches, will receive of the plagues of God just as verily as the churches who oppose the law of God." E.G. White, Letter 35, 1898.


If Laodicea is not regarded with any more favor by God than the fallen churches, and the call of Laodicea is to all churches, then there is no difference between Laodicea and the fallen churches as far as being in a fallen state is concerned. Different churches believe different aspects of Babylonian teachings, but Ellen White equates them all as far as falling from the favor of God is concerned, and as far as constituting the cage of every unclean and hateful bird.


God’s True Organized Body


God says in Isaiah 56:10-12 that professed “watchmen” like Dr. Walter Veith and other SDA leaders, ALL cannot understand the truth. Do you believe God? Or does your mind instantly begin to reflect on your favorite SDA leaders whom YOU THINK to be pure wheat? They will not understand or agree with what constitutes the real organized body of Christ. It would be too demeaning to their ecclesiastical, spiritual and human pride to cede to a mere “pawn” messenger like me. I am as nothing to them. And in essence, Ellen White is as nothing to them because they glean from her only what supports their perverted preferences. And what is far worse, God’s Word is as nothing to them because they grossly violate it.


In Testimonies, Vol. 5, 211, Ellen White indicts them with UNBELIEF. They don’t really believe her or God’s Word. Thus, they grossly violate both. The church claims the gift of prophecy as a device or proselytizing numbers, but like the Jews, they do not heed the prophets.


But getting back to God’s True organized body, we are going to study the experience of that body past and present. Jesus asked poignant questions as a teaching device, so that is what I am going to employ in regard to God’s organized body.




·       Going way back to Shiloh, the first civilized encampment of the Tabernacle after the 40 years Israel wandered in the Sinai desert, who was God’s organized church per the following statement:  "The recreant priests added licentiousness to the dark catalogue of their crimes yet they still polluted by their presence the tabernacle of the Lord, and, laden with sin, dared to come into the presence of a holy God. As the men of Israel witnessed the corrupt course of the priests, they thought it safer for their families not to come up to the appointed place of worship. Many went from Shiloh with their peace disturbed, their indignation aroused, until they at last determined to offer their sacrifices themselves, concluding that this would be fully as acceptable to God, as to sanction in any manner the abominations practiced in the Sanctuary." E.G. White, The Signs of the Times, vol. 1, p. 264, col. 3, December 1, 1881.

·       Was the apostate “organized” appointed place (Sanctuary—the Tabernacle) God’s organized body, His true church, or was it those who worshipped at home and offered sacrifices themselves?

·       Was the above group God’s church split into atoms, a cult, stray offshoots here and there, or were they actually God’s church where His presence was? Was His presence at the apostate Sanctuary?

·       Who, what, where, when and why, was God’s organized body (church) in the following Bible verses? 


9And the LORD said unto me, A conspiracy is found among the men of Judah, and among the inhabitants of Jerusalem.

 10They are turned back to the iniquities of their forefathers, which refused to hear my words; and they went after other gods to serve them: the house of Israel and the house of Judah have broken my covenant which I made with their fathers.

 11Therefore thus saith the LORD, Behold, I will bring evil upon them, which they shall not be able to escape; and though they shall cry unto me, I will not hearken unto them.

 12Then shall the cities of Judah and inhabitants of Jerusalem go, and cry unto the gods unto whom they offer incense: but they shall not save them at all in the time of their trouble.

 13For according to the number of thy cities were thy gods, O Judah; and according to the number of the streets of Jerusalem have ye set up altars to that shameful thing, even altars to burn incense unto Baal.

 14Therefore pray not thou for this people, neither lift up a cry or prayer for them: for I will not hear them in the time that they cry unto me for their trouble.

 15What hath my beloved to do in mine house, seeing she hath wrought lewdness with many, and the holy flesh is passed from thee? when thou doest evil, then thou rejoicest.” Jeremiah 11:9-15.


·       Who is implied by the words “my beloved?” Is it not the faithful bride of Christ?

·       Who is God’s organized body in the above Bible verses?

·       Where was the porch and the altar the faithful were to weep between in the above verses?

·       Where was sealing, saving virtue?

·       Who is implied by the words “she hath wrought lewdness with many?” Those words indict the Temple leaders and all who followed them in apostasy.

·       What do the words “...and the holy flesh is passed from thee” mean? God departed because He cannot remain where sin is practised.

·       What do the words: “....when thou doest evil, then thou rejoicest” mean? I’ll tell you exactly what they mean in application to the modern-day apostasy of SDA’s who joined Vatican II’s Celebration Movement, which also embraced the vile actions of the Pentecostal movement. And what did SDA’s doe when they did evil by joining that movement? They celebrated! They REJOICED! They rejoiced in their iniquity. And Ellen White saw them raucous rejoicing in that iniquity right up to just before the probation, to wit:

·       "The things you have described as taking place in Indiana, the Lord has shown me would take place just before the close of probation. Every uncouth thing will be demonstrated. There will be shouting, with drums, music, and dancing. The senses of rational beings will become so confused that they cannot be trusted to make right decisions. And this is called the moving of the Holy Spirit. 
The Holy Spirit never reveals itself in such methods, in such a bedlam of noise. This is an invention of Satan to cover up his ingenious methods for making of none effect the pure, sincere, elevating, ennobling, sanctifying truth for this time. Better never have the worship of God blended with music than to use musical instruments to do the work which last January was represented to me
would be brought into our camp meetings. The truth for this time needs nothing of this kind in its work of converting souls. A bedlam of noise shocks the senses and pervert that which if conducted aright might be a blessing. The powers of satanic agencies blend with the din and noise, to have a carnival, and this is termed the Holy Spirits working." Selected Messages, Vol. 2, p. 36.

·       Tell me friends, how does a church imbibe every uncouth thing up to just before the close of probation and THEN develop the character to be saved? Please write and tell me all about it and I will publish your response on my Website. But do us both a favor and don’t forget to reconcile Ellen White’s 1884 prophesied outcome of the church in your statement of rebuttal. The Great Controversy, 1884 edition, pp. 199, 200, cited in this document. And before you submit your rebuttal, please ask Dr. Walter Veith and your pastor to explain that statement. Why is not the young couple who interviews Dr. Veith on YouTube not asking these types of questions? Is it because they do not want to know the truth? Is it because they don’t want to disturb the status quo and peace and safety by rocking the proverbial boat? I’ll let them answer these questions if they will, and I will publish their response on my Website. I promise!

·       God’s people conspired with His enemies. That was unpardonable sin.

·       Will God have to apologize to the apostate Jews of Jeremiah 11:9-15, because He permits His people today to conspire/confederate with His enemies today—Babylon associations, counsels/councils, girdings and confederacies/conspiracies via ecumenical liaison with Babylon EVEN IF IT WERE ONLY MEMBERSHIP IN BABYLON’S LOCAL MINISTERIAL ASSOCIATIONS, WHICH EVERY SDA MEMBER CAN PROVE, even when the leaders lie about more deeply entrenched ecumenical MEMBERSHIP in most of the National Councils of Churches in the civilized world.

·       Can Walter Veith and any other SDA leader understand and define the point at which the professing SDA committed unpardonable sin? Two credentialed ministers with their Doctorate of Divinity, Dr.’s John Grosboll and the late Dr. Ralph Larson, rightly concluded that the church had committed unpardonable sin. The unpardonable sins are:


1.    The antichrist embracement of Rome’s central doctrine, the Trinity Doctrine.

2.    Disobedience of Isaiah 8:9-12, via ecumenical conspiracy/confederation/association with fallen Babylon, God’s enemies, with the only option being “broken in pieces,” stated three times because of the seriousness of this issue.

3.    Embracing an antichrist doctrine on the human nature of Jesus Christ.

4.    The worst abominations are not knows to us says Ellen White, to wit:    


“The abominations for which the faithful ones were sighing and crying were all that could be discerned by finite eyes, but by far the worst sins, those which provoked the jealousy of the pure and holy God, were unrevealed. The great Searcher of hearts knoweth every sin committed in secret by the workers of iniquity. These persons come to feel secure in their deceptions and, because of His long-suffering, say that the Lord seeth not, and then act as though He had forsaken the earth. But He will detect their hypocrisy and will open before others those sins which they were so careful to hide.” {5T 211.3}Which church was God’s organized body in the following statement? Was this church split into atoms? Was it “disorganized?” Was it an offshoot cult?  


"The Sanhedrin had rejected Christ's message and was bent upon His death therefore Jesus departed from Jerusalem, from the priests, the temple, the religious leaders, the people who had been instructed in the law, and turned to another class to proclaim His message, and to gather out those who should carry the gospel to all nations.

As the light and life of men was rejected by the ecclesiastical authorities in the days of Christ, so it has been rejected in every succeeding generation. Again and again the history of Christ's withdrawal from Judea has been repeated. When the Reformers preached the word of God, they had no thought of separating themselves from the established church but the religious leaders would not tolerate the light, and those that bore it were forced to seek another class, who were longing for the truth. In our day few of the professed followers of the Reformers are actuated by their spirit. Few are listening for the voice of God, and ready to accept truth in whatever guise it may be presented. Often [PRESENT TENSE] those who follow in the steps of the Reformers are forced to turn away from the churches they love, in order to declare the plain teaching of the word of God. And many times those who are seeking for light are by the same teaching obliged to leave the church of their fathers, that they may render obedience." E.G. White, Desire of Ages, 232.


·       What? I thought God does not withdraw from His people! What is that word “withdrawal” doing in that statement anyway?! And it says Christ’s withdrawal has occurred in every succeeding generation! What?! Is this a generation?! Are there true reformers in this generation?!

·       Where was the porch and altar when Jesus left the Temple and gathered out those who would take the gospel to the world?

·       Where was the “organized church body” when Jesus left and gathered out His disciples from the apostate church?

·       Why did the true reformers leave the churches of their fathers? What is the ONE REASON?

·       Do the leaders today tolerate the light I am presenting in this document?

·       Are such PRESENT DAY Reformers a cult? Are they mere offshoots? Are they split off atoms? Have they split the apostate church into atoms? Have they split God’s true church into atoms? Are they an organized UNDER CHRIST body? If not friend, why not?!


Who, What, Where, When and Way was the true organized body of Christ in the following statements by Holy Spirit to our church?


"Christ was a protestant...The Reformers date back to Christ and the apostles. They came out and separated themselves from a religion of forms and ceremonies. Luther and his followers did not invent the reformed religion. They simply accepted it as presented by Christ and the apostles." E.G. White, Review and Herald, vol. 2, 48, col. 2.


·       I thought the wheat and tares are supposed to grow together until the harvest at the end of time—until the close of probation, Christ’s Object Lessons, p. 70 and on.

·       Was Christ an offshoot? Did He break the true church up into atoms? Did He form a strayed cult? Did he split the organized church up into atoms?

·       Was there no organized church through whom Christ would work when He gathered out those who would do His will?

·       Was the Reformation an offshoot cult? Or were the Reformation Reformers the true church of their day organized under Christ?

·       Didn’t Christ know the wheat and tares were supposed to dwell together until the end of time, until the end of probation? Did He violate His own message? Or are tares different from open sinners?

·       If you have to impugn (judge) the motives of tares in order to uproot them, are they different from open sinners whom we are instructed to REFORM OR UPROOT IF THEY WON’T REPENT? Tares are insincere believers, NOT OPEN SINNERS.

·       Where was the porch and the altar in the days of Christ’s ministry on earth and in the days of the Protestant Reformation?


Paul left


"And as they persisted in their rejection of the gospel the apostle (Paul) went into the synagogue, and spake boldly for the space of three months, disputing and persuading the things concerning the kingdom of God. But when divers were hardened, and believed not, but spake evil of that way before the multitude, he departed from them, and separated the disciples, disputing daily in the school of one Tyrannus." Acts, 19:8, 9.


"Fearing that the faith of the believers would be endangered by continued association with these opposers of the truth, Paul separated from them, and gathered the disciples into a distinct body." E.G. White, Acts of the Apostles, p. 286.


·       Where was the organized church when Paul separated and separated the disciples?

·       Where was the porch and the altar where they could weep between?

·       Were they offshoots splitting the organized church up into atoms?

·       Why did Paul separate by departing from the apostates?

·       Didn’t Paul know that the wheat and the tares were supposed to dwell tighter until the harvest at the very end of time?!

·       Will Paul be lost because he violated that condition?


Home Churches in Scripture


It should be clear that if Christ and His Holy Spirit are not present, no valid church accrues. Christ and His Holy Spirit are the leader of any valid church.


Act 13:1 Now there were in the church that was at Antioch certain prophets and teachers; as Barnabas, and Simeon that was called Niger, and Lucius of Cyrene, and Manaen, which had been brought up with Herod the tetrarch, and Saul.


Rom 16:5 Likewise [greet] the church that is in their house. Salute my well beloved Epaenetus, who is the firstfruits of Achaia unto Christ.


Phm 1:2 And to [our] beloved Apphia, and Archippus our fellow soldier, and to the church in thy house:


1Cr 16:19 The churches of Asia salute you. Aquila and Priscilla salute you much in the Lord, with the church that is in their house.


Col 4:15 Salute the brethren which are in Laodicea, and Nymphas, and the church which is in his house.


1 Corinthians 14:26 describes an early church meeting, in which everyone present shared in providing hymns, instruction, revelation, tongues, or interpretation.


1Cr 14:26 How is it then, brethren? when ye come together, every one of you hath a psalm, hath a doctrine, hath a tongue, hath a revelation, hath an interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying.


Act 14:23 And when they had ordained them elders in every church, and had prayed with fasting, they commended them to the Lord, on whom they believed.


Act 14:27 And when they were come, and had gathered the church together, they rehearsed all that God had done with them, and how he had opened the door of faith unto the Gentiles.


1Pe 5:13 The [church that is] at Babylon, elected together with [you], saluteth you; and [so doth] Marcus my son.


Rom 16:1 I commend unto you Phebe our sister, which is a servant of the church which is at Cenchrea:


Col 4:16 And when this epistle is read among you, cause that it be read also in the church of the Laodiceans; and that ye likewise read the [epistle] from Laodicea.


1Cr 1:2 Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called [to be] saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both theirs and ours:


·       Where these churches of “separated brethren” offshoots who split the true church up into atoms? Were they a stray offshoot cult? Was Christ in their presence?

·       Where was the porch and the alter when these churches were formed?

·       Where were the members of those churches sealed and saved?

·       Were these churches God’s organized church through whom He worked?


"There is a little hope in one direction: Take the young men and women, and place them where they will come as little in contact with our churches as possible, that the low grade of piety which is current in this day shall not leaven their ideas of what it means to be a Christian." E.G. White, Manuscript Release #995, p. 5.


·       Where was the true church when these young men and woman were placed where they would come into contact with the established church as little as possible? Were they offshoots? Did they break the established church organization up into atoms? Were they stray offshoots here and there?

·       If Ellen White gave the above instruction in the alpha heresy, what in God’s world would she say today in the omega heresy WERE SHE CONSISTENT and she said consistency is a jewel. The Holy Spirit is consistent!


Ellen White on Home Churches


When the young men and women were kept away from the Alpha of apostasy in the church, what did they do where did they meet for worship?


"There is a little hope in one direction: Take the young men and women, and place them where they will come as little in contact with our churches as possible, that the low grade of piety which is current in this day shall not leaven their ideas of what it means to be a Christian." E.G. White, Manuscript Release #995, p. 5.


"Brother and sister Haskell have rented a house in one of the best parts of the city, and have gathered round them a family of helpers, who day by day go out giving Bible readings, selling our papers, and doing medical missionary work. During the hour of worship, the workers relate their experiences. Bible studies are regularly conducted in the home, and THE YOUNG MEN AND YOUNG WOMEN connected with the mission receive a practical, thorough training in holding Bible readings and in selling our publications. The Lord has blessed their labors, a number have embraced the truth, and many others are deeply interested." Review and Herald, September 7, 1905, Evangelism, p. 108.


Where was God’s Organized Body in 1844?


In the spring and summer of 1844, it was estimated that
Adventists numbered from 50,000 to 120,000, yet on the morning of October 22, 1844, only fifty (50) souls remained faithful out of the large number that had professed to believe in Christ’s coming at that date.


·       Who was the organized body of Christ on that day?

·       Was that small number of 50 an offshoot sect, a cult?

·       Did that small number divide God’s church into atoms?

·       Were they called a cult until 1957?

·       Why did they separate from apostasy if the wheat are to dwell with the tares until the close of probation, IF TARES ARE NO DIFFERENT FROM APOSTATES?


Dr. Walter Veith on Intercession, Reconciliation


It is a distinct spiritual and criminal abomination in and of itself to attempt to proffer, pedal and propose intercession and reconciliation as being available to God’s people AS A CORPORATE APOSTATE CHURCH, Laodicea, after that once church has committed unpardonable sin. At that point God asks the same question He poses in Jeremiah 11:15, “...what hath my beloved [bride] to do in mine house [church] since she has wrought lewdness with many.”


Dr. Veith has not a clue as to the seriousness of the apostasy of the SDA church leaders, and he denounces corporate responsibility for their gross apostasies, such as that of the SDA leader of the German Union Conference who signed the SDA church in Germany into ecumenical alliance with the German Federation of Churches, Satan’s subsidiary to his World Council of Churches, whose stated goal is to make all churches one, with the implied intention of ONE WORLD DAY OF WORSHIP.


Consider Dr. Walter Veith’s (Contradiction to the Spirit of Prophecy) admonition of the element of INTERCESSION as mentioned on his video on Laodicea cf. Ellen White’s quoting of the apostles in prophesying that Jeremiah 11 would have another fulfillment, to wit: [Please note the word INTERCESSION]:




COUNTERPART: "The Lord commanded one of his ancient servants, 'Pray not thou for this people [Jer. 7:16 and 11:14], neither lift up cry nor prayer for them neither make intercession to me for I will not hear thee.' The prophet thus describes the sins which had called forth this fearful denunciation: 'The prophets prophesy falsely, and the priests bear rule by their means and my people love to have it so and what will ye do in the end thereof?' 'From the least of them even unto the greatest of them, every one is given to covetousness and from the prophet even unto the priest, every one dealeth falsely. They have healed also the hurt of the daughter of my people slightly, saying, Peace, peace, when there is no peace.' The apostles declare that this state of things will find its COUNTERPART in the last days. Many have a form of godliness, but in their daily life deny the power thereof. They have ceased to be convicted of their sins or alarmed at their state. They say in their hearts, 'The church is flourishing. Peace and spiritual prosperity are within her borders.' The words of the prophet may well apply to these self-deceivers, 'They have chosen their own ways, and their soul delighteth in their abominations. I also will choose their delusions, and will bring their fears upon them." E. G. White, Second Advent Review and Sabbath Herald, 11-07-82.


"Shall the Lord be compelled to say, `Pray not thou for this people, neither lift up cry nor prayer for them, neither make intercession to Me: for I will not hear thee' [Jeremiah 7:16]? `Therefore the showers have been withholden, and there hath been no latter rain....Wilt thou not from this time cry unto Me, My Father, thou art the guide of my youth' [Jeremiah 3:3-4]?...
We are to be judged by the light that has been given us,(159) and we can find no excuse by which to extenuate our course."
Review and Herald, Vol. 3, p 69-70 (August 1, 1893). (Brackets by Ellen White)
COUNTERPART: "In the time of the Saviour, the Jews had so covered over the precious jewels of truth with the rubbish of tradition and fable, that it was impossible to distinguish the true from the false. The Saviour came to clear away the rubbish of superstition and long-cherished errors, and to set the jewels of God's word in the framework of truth. What would the Saviour do if he should come to us now as he did to the Jews? He would have to do a similar work in clearing away the rubbish of tradition and ceremony. The Jews were greatly disturbed when he did this work [As are SDA's today!]. They had lost sight of the original truth of God, but Christ brought it again to view. It is our work to free the precious truths of God from superstition and error." E.G. White,  Review
and Herald, Vol. 2, 308. 


The Lord commanded one of his ancient servants, "Pray not thou for this people, neither lift up cry nor prayer for them; neither make intercession to me; for I will not hear thee." The prophet thus describes the sins which had called forth this fearful denunciation: "The prophets prophesy falsely, and the priests bear rule by their means; and my people love to have it so; and what will ye do in the end thereof?" "From the least of them even unto the greatest of them, every one is given to covetousness; and from the prophet even unto the priest, every one dealeth falsely. They have healed also the hurt of the daughter of my people slightly, saying, Peace, peace, when there is no peace." {RH, November 7, 1882 par. 8}


     The apostles declare that this state of things will find its counterpart in the last days. Many have a form of godliness, but in their daily life deny the power thereof. They have ceased to be convicted of their sins or alarmed at their state. They say in their hearts, "The church is flourishing. Peace and spiritual prosperity are within her borders." The words of the prophet may well apply to these self-deceivers, "They have chosen their own ways, and their soul delighteth in their abominations. I also will choose their delusions, and will bring their fears upon them." {RH, November 7, 1882 par. 9}


Who else but SDA’s could qualify as the COUNTERPART of the Jews when they both are “chosen people” who claim to keep the commandments of God and constitute a remnant?!


Many SDA’s are worshipping the idol tales of Dr. Veith to their own damnation. I recommend Dr. Veith’s materials because he gives a lot of important truth but it is mingled with serious errors. Heed the truth parts but avoid his serious errors or you will lose your salvation. And remember that Satan uses that very device of mixing truth with error with such deceptive adeptness that he appears to many as an angel of light. And he is accusing those with the true light with this very accusation.


May God’s people awaken to the seriousness of the times, is my every continuum of prayer.




Note: While I am writing a document I often make a note to myself with the words “Begin Ron” so I can find my place when I have to be called away from writing. So if I forget to delete such a reminder to myself, you will know what I mean. I did that in the last document I wrote.