The Apostate SDA Church Will not be Blotted Out

that it will not Exist


Part I


Click to go to our Home Page






Dear Reader,


What follows is a discussion over an Ellen G. White statement that the leaders and laity of new movement Adventism misapply to convince folk to stay with the ship no matter what apostasy it commits. The study gets much more serious as the part to this series continues.


I am going to deal with such implications as:

·      What type of weed cannot grow with the wheat without killing (choking) it out.

·      Why the church was not Babylon in Ellen White's lifetime.

·      How Ellen White said the church could become part of Babylon.

·      The difference between Babylon and her daughters.

·      What is worse than Babylon?

·      When Ellen White advised remaining away from the church in the Alpha of Apostasy.

·      Does Ellen White’s Statement about the church not being broken-up into independent atoms give the church an UNCONDITIONAL approval by God to imperviously commit whatever apostasy it wishes?

·      What Ellen White would be forced to do today in order to be consistent with God's Word and her teaching concerning apostasy? Where did Ellen White draw a line in the sand? Why?

·      What commandments of God go beyond playing the harlot as ancient Israel and modern Israel have so done?

·      What it means to MARRY into Satan's confederacy.

·      What constitutes God's church?

·      When God no longer considers a professing church as a valid church.

·      Did God close the probation of some generation(s) of the world before the general close of probation in A.D. 34, at the stoning of Stephen and the end of the 70 weeks of Daniel 9:24.

·      Why Ellen White called the church a harlot at least four times but did not leave the church.

·      Why the church did not commit unpardonable apostasy in Ellen White's tenure in the church.

·      Did anyone leave apostate Israel centuries BEFORE its general close of probation in A.D. 34, and if so why?

·      Were there independent home churches BEFORE the general close of probation for Israel? Did these home churches break the true church up into independent atoms?

·      Was the SDA church broken up into independent atoms in the Kellogg Alpha Apostasy when Ellen White said to keep the youth as far away from the churches as possible?

·      Did faithful Jews leave the precincts of the Temple to worship at home centuries before the general close of probation for Israel and why? Did their action break the church up into atoms and/or make it so that it did not exist?

·      Did Jesus and the disciples leave apostate Israel BEFORE its general close of probation? If so, why?

·      Did Jesus’ gathering out of His disciples BEFORE the general close of Israel’s probation, break up the “church” into independent atoms?

·      Did the home churches established by the disciples of Christ, break up the “church” into independent atoms?

·      Did Paul break up the church into independent atoms when He left the apostate Jewish church AFTER THREE MONTHS?

·      Was the example of Christ, His disciples evidence that the same thing might occur in the SDA church?

·      Did God ever give ancient or modern spiritual Israel UNCONDITIONAL status as a “chosen people” no matter what apostasy they should imbibe?

·      Can members of the church be responsible for corporate unpardonable sin of its leaders? When and how does such a serious situation accrue?

·      Was there evidence in 1882, in Testimonies, Vol. 5, p. 207 and the remainder of the chapter, that Laodicea would ultimately fail, and if so, what is the meaning of Ellen White's statement below that there was not the least evidence that such a thing would be?






----- Original Message -----

From: Ron Beaulieu


Sent: Wednesday, July 08, 2009 10:41 AM

Subject: Fw: Church Not to Be Broken Up




I meant to comment on the QUALIFYING WORDS: "...the church that keeps the commandments of God." Does a church with abominations for which we are to sigh and cry about in order to receive the seal of God, keep the commandments of God? If you think it does, please tell me how that is possible?




----- Original Message -----

From: Ron Beaulieu


Sent: Wednesday, July 08, 2009 10:38 AM

Subject: Church Not to Be Broken Up




We need to study the following statement very carefully and prayerfully. We need to look for qualifying words.


The Church Not to Be Broken Up Into Atoms


"Again I say, The Lord hath not spoken by any messenger who calls the church that keeps the commandments of God, Babylon. True, there are tares with the wheat; but Christ said He would send His angels to first gather the tares and bind them in bundles to burn them, but gather the wheat into the garner. I know that the Lord loves His church. It is not to be disorganized or broken up into independent atoms. There is not the least consistency in this; there is not the least evidence that such a thing will be. Those who shall heed this false message and try to leaven others will be deceived and prepared to receive advanced delusions, and they will come to nought.


There is in some of the members of the church, pride, self-sufficiency, stubborn unbelief, and a refusing to yield their ideas, although evidence may be piled upon evidence which makes the message to the Laodicean church applicable. But that will not blot out the church that it will not exist. Let both tares and wheat grow together until the harvest. Then it is the angels that do the work of separation.


I warn the Seventh-day Adventist Church to be careful how you receive every new notion and those who claim to have great light. The character of their work seems to be to accuse and to tear down." Selected Messages, Bk. 2, p. 68.



·         I wish to go on record for stating that I fully believe that the SDA new movement church will NEVER be broken up into independent atoms for 1SM 205 says that "nothing will be allowed to stand in its way."

·         If that church were broken up into atoms, there would be no intact Sanctuary for God to BEGIN Ezekiel 9 at. Testimonies, Vol. 5, 211.

·         Indeed, there is not the least evidence that such a thing will be. (Until the Ezekiel 9 destruction of that church which God and Ellen White prophesied).

·         Tares and wheat could mature in Laodicea because the Laodicean condition was once lukewarm, NOT COLD APOSTATE.

·         Cold Apostasy is far different than lukewarm--neither hot nor cold.

·         The cold apostate new movement masquerading as lukewarm Laodicea is full of open sin apostasy.

·         Open sin is defined as THORNS, not TARES. How do we know that for sure? Because we are told that thorns CHOKE out the wheat and make it impossible to mature. Tares don't do that because tares will be amongst ALL CHURCH GROUPS until the close of probation. Ellen White says that.

·         Thorns, open sinners, were to be reformed. If they refuse to reform, they are to be separated from the church because they make it IMPOSSIBLE for the wheat to mature.

·         Sighing and crying for all the abominations is not wrongful accusing and tearing down.

·         Sighing and crying is crying aloud, sparing not, to show God's people their sins, Isaiah 58:1. Ellen White said that this chapter in Scripture is OUR WORK.

·         Ellen White says the omega apostasy (CHECK FULL CONTEXT) will wax stronger until Jesus comes:

Wax stronger "One thing it is certain is soon to be realized, the great apostasy, which is developing and increasing and waxing stronger, and will continue to do so until the Lord shall descend from heaven with a shout. We are to hold fast the first principles of our denominated faith, and go forward from strength to increased faith. Ever we are to keep the faith that has been substantiated by the Holy Spirit of God from the earlier events of our experience until the present time. We need now larger breadth, and deeper, more earnest, unwavering faith in the leadings of the Holy Spirit. If we needed the manifest proof of the Holy Spirit's power to confirm truth in the beginning, after the passing of the time, we need to-day all the evidence in the confirmation of the truth, when souls are departing from the faith and giving heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of devils. There must not be any languishing of soul now." (E.G. White, Special Testimonies, Series B, No. 7, p. 57).

·         God and Ellen White said it is impossible to unite with the corrupt and remain/or become pure:

"It is IMPOSSIBLE for you to unite with those who are corrupt, and still remain pure. (II Corinthians 6:14-15 quoted). God and Christ and the heavenly host would have men know that if he unites with the corrupt he will become corrupt." E. G. White, Review and Herald, Vol. 4, p. 137.

Eze 2:6

And thou, son of man, be not afraid of them, neither be afraid of their words, though briers and thorns [be] with thee, and thou dost dwell among scorpions: be not afraid of their words, nor be dismayed at their looks, though they [be] a rebellious house.

How frequently ancient Israel rebelled, and how often were they visited with judgments, and thousands slain because they would not heed the commands of God who had chosen them. {RH, June 25, 1861 par. 25}

"Thorns sprung up.--The thorns made it impossible for the wheat to mature

 (see Luke 8:14). In the same way secular interests prevent the fruits of the Spirit (Gal. 5:22, 23) from reaching maturity. Religion is relegated to the subordinate position of being only one interest among many. For lack of cultivation it withers and eventually dies. That which the thorny-ground hearers lack is a moral transformation [E.G. White, Christ's Object Lessons,  p. 50]  To them, justification is the sum and substance of religion, and they fail to realize that the Christian life consists essentially in the process known as sanctification--the process by which evil traits and tendencies are replaced by the perfect life-pattern of Jesus Christ." Seventh-day Adventist Bible Commentary, vol. 5, 405.

·         Ellen White said that we all have the same duty as Ezekiel, within our ability, to warn His people:

“So far as his opportunities extend, every one who has received the light of truth is under the same solemn and fearful responsibility as was the prophet of Israel, to whom the word of the Lord came, saying: "Son of man, I have set thee a watchman unto the house of Israel; therefore thou shalt hear the word at my mouth, and warn them from me.  When I say unto the wicked, O wicked man surely die; if thou dost not speak to warn the wicked from his way, that wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at thine hand.  Nevertheless, if thou warn the wicked of his way to turn from it; if he do not turn from his way, he shall die in his iniquity, but thou has delivered thy soul.”  Eze 33:7-9.  The Great Controversy,  p. 459.

"The plain straight testimony must live in the church, or the curse of God will rest upon His people as surely as it did upon ancient Israel because of their sins. God holds His people, as a body [corporately], responsible for the sins existing in individuals among them." Testimonies, Vol. 3, p. 269.


"Any connection with infidels and UNBELIEVERS which would identify us with them is FORBIDDEN by the word. We are to come out from them and be separate. In no case are we to link ourselves with them in their plans or work." E. G. White,  Fundamentals of Christian Education,  482.

·         Isaiah 8:9-13 strictly forbids any connection with unbelievers. Ellen White says that the fallen churches are indistinguishable from the world and the world does not BELIEVE. Early Writings, 273.

·         It is the THIRD ANGEL, whom Ellen White defines as faithful men who select the wheat from the tares. They do it with a sifting, shaking message that separates the wheat from the tares. They are to separate THORNS from the wheat if the THORNS will not reform.

·         If the church will not separate the OPEN SINNING THORNS, then we must separate from such a church that will not heed God's instruction.

Is this presentation of evidence fair and true? Does any member of this forum dispute this evidence? If anyone has any question(s) whatsoever, I will patiently respond to all enquiries.


All His blessings,





----- Original Message -----

From: Ron Beaulieu


Sent: Wednesday, July 08, 2009 10:53 AM

Subject: Re: [AdventistHotIssues] Re: 'Proof' of Kenyan birth twice scrubbed by eBay


Brother Brian et all,


Praise God that you can discern the difference between COLD, APOSTASY, and mere defects and faults of lukewarm Laodiceans. But Ellen White said that if the church even became lukewarm Laodicean, that it was no better than the churches that are the cage of every unclean and hateful bird--in short, Babylon! She said it, not I!


"If the church of God becomes LUKEWARM [LAODICEAN] it does not stand in favor with God any more than do the churches that are represented as having fallen and become the habitation of devils and the hold of every foul spirit and the cage of every unclean and hateful bird. Those who have had opportunities to hear and receive the truth, and who have united with the Seventh-day Adventist church, calling themselves the commandment keeping people of God, and yet possess no more vitality and consecration to God than do the nominal churches, will receive of the plagues of God just as verily as the churches who oppose the law of God." E.G. White, Letter 35, 1898.

Is the message to Laodicea, Rev. 3, a commandment of God--to buy gold tried in the fire--faith that works by the indwelling self-sacrificing love of Christ? Is the church keeping that commandment? If Laodicea is the foolish virgin state of the church, is Laodicea the final church? Are foolish virgins saved? Are these valid questions?

Then she first indicted the church for becoming Laodicean in 1852! So the church has been in that condition for 157 years.




----- Original Message -----

From: luke19v10


Sent: Wednesday, July 08, 2009 10:41 AM

Subject: [AdventistHotIssues] Re: 'Proof' of Kenyan birth twice scrubbed by eBay

Brother Ron,

It frustrates me really almost to the point of despair and I loathe my life! EGW stated it best, the thorns keep the wheat from maturing. I am sometimes labeled as a theorist and my motives and character are assailed.  Praise God for this forum where at least I can know sincere searchers after truth, the WHOLE truth about everything!



--- In, "Ron Beaulieu" <rsbeauli@... wrote:

 Dear Brother Brian,
 Amen! How does it affect you when SDA's lust after peace and safety and hide behind some of Ellen White's statements to commit all manner of apostasy and interpret her to say that the church will remain the house of God no matter what it does! Here is a classic:
 Chap. 278 - "The Apple of His Eye"
 For thus saith the Lord of hosts; After the glory hath he sent me unto the nations which spoiled you: for he that toucheth you toucheth the apple of his eye. Zech. 2:8. {HP 284.1}
 The church of Christ, enfeebled and defective as it may be, is the only object on earth on which He bestows His supreme regard. . . . The Lord has a people, a chosen people, His church, to be His own, His own fortress, which He holds in a sin-stricken, revolted world. {HP 284.2}
 The church is the property of God, and God constantly remembers her as she stands in the world, subject to the temptations of Satan. Christ has never forgotten the days of His humiliation. In passing from the scenes of His humiliation, Jesus has lost none of His humanity. He has the same tender, pitying love, and is ever touched with human woe. He ever bears in mind that He was a Man of Sorrows and acquainted with grief. He forgets not His representative people who are striving to uphold His downtrodden law. He knows that the world that hated Him, hates them. Although Jesus Christ has passed into the heavens, there is still a living chain binding His believing ones to His own heart of infinite love. The most lowly and weak are bound by a chain of sympathy closely to His heart. He never forgets that He is our representative, that He bears our nature. {HP 284.3}
 Jesus sees His true church on the earth, whose greatest ambition is to cooperate with Him in the grand work of saving souls. He hears their prayers, presented in contrition and power, and Omnipotence cannot resist their plea for the salvation of any tried, tempted member of Christ's body. . . . Jesus ever liveth to make intercession for us. Through our Redeemer what blessings may not the true believer receive? The church, soon to enter upon her most severe conflict, will be the object most dear to God upon earth. {HP 284.4}
 The confederacy of evil will be stirred with power from beneath, and Satan will cast all the reproach possible upon the chosen ones whom he cannot deceive and delude with his satanic inventions and falsehoods. But exalted "to be a Prince and a Saviour, . . ." (Acts 5:31), will Christ, our representative and head, close His heart, or withdraw His hand, or falsify His promise? No; never, never. {HP 284.5}
 What church is the "apple of God's eye" and will enter upon her most severe conflict? Is it the one described by the following statements?:
 "The church is in the Laodicean state. The presence of God is not in her midst.--NL 99 (1898). Latter Day Events, p. 49.
 "To the end of time, the presence of the Spirit is to abide with the true church." E.G. White, Acts of the Apostles, p. 55.
 "The state of the Church represented by the foolish virgins, is also spoken of as the Laodicean state." E. G. White, Review and Herald Articles, Vol. 2, 420, 8/19/1890. 
 Pray tell: If the church represented by the foolish virgins is the Laodicean state of the church, how could Laodicea be the final church?! Are the foolish virgins saved?

 "The Testimony For The Church-The Laodicean Church-What greater deception can come upon human minds than a confidence that they are right when they are ALL WRONG?" Testimonies, Vol. 3, pp. 253, 254.
 "If the church of God becomes LUKEWARM [LAODICEAN] it does not stand in favor with God any more than do the churches that are represented as having fallen and become the habitation of devils and the hold of every foul spirit and the cage of every unclean and hateful bird. Those who have had opportunities to hear and receive the truth, and who have united with the Seventh-day Adventist church, calling themselves the commandment keeping people of God, and yet possess no more vitality and consecration to God than do the nominal churches, will receive of the plagues of God just as verily as the churches who oppose the law of God." E.G. White, Letter 35, 1898.
 Did the church become Laodicean? Has she remained Laodicean since 1852?
 Laodicean 1852 (June 10) "Many who profess to be looking for the speedy coming of Christ, are becoming conformed to this world, and seek more earnestly the applause of those around them, than the approbation of God. They are cold and formal, like the nominal church, that they but a short time since separated from. The words addressed to the Laodicean Church, describe their present condition perfectly....And unless they heed the counsel of the 'faithful and True Witness,' and zealously repent, and obtain 'gold tried in the fire,' 'white raiment,' and 'eye-salve,' he will spue them out of his mouth." E.G. White, Review and Herald, June 10, 1852, Vol. 1, p. 18, col. 2.
 "The warning for the last church [Laodicea] also must be proclaimed to all who claim to be Christians. The Laodicean message, like a sharp, two--edged sword, must go to ALL THE CHURCHES:...It is our work to proclaim this message. Are we putting forth every effort that the churches may be warned?" Testimonies, vol. 6, p. 77.
 If Laodicea is not regarded with any more favor by God than the fallen churches, and the call of Laodicea is to all churches, then there is no difference between Laodicea and the fallen churches as far as being in a fallen state is concerned. Different churches believe different aspects of Babylonian teachings, but Ellen White equates them all as far as falling from the favor of God is concerned, and as far as constituting the habitation of devils and the hold of every foul spirit and the cage of every unclean and hateful bird.
 "We must as a people arouse and cleanse the camp of Israel. Licentiousness, unlawful intimacy, and unholy practices are coming in among us in a large degree...We are in danger of becoming a sister to fallen Babylon, of allowing our churches to become corrupted and filled with every foul spirit, a cage for every unclean and hateful bird, and will we be clear unless we make decided movements to cure the existing evil? E. G. White, Manuscript Releases No. 449, pp. 17, 18. (Letter 51, 1886 to Elder Butler) Testimonies on Sexual Behavior, Adultery, and Divorce, p. 193.
 Has the church (with the same divorce rate as the world according to the Adventist Review) been cleansed of licentiousness and unlawful intimacy and unholy practices? Or has it become worse than ever in her history?

 ----- Original Message -----
 From: luke19v10
 Sent: Wednesday, July 08, 2009 2:55 AM
 Subject: [AdventistHotIssues] Re: 'Proof' of Kenyan birth twice scrubbed by eBay

Dear Ron,
My indignation arises when I think of the lust after peace and safety that causes most individuals to disregard such clear evidence as non-sense. I am often regarded as one who is mentally ill and gullible even by family and friends when I present such evidence as if they are a fabrication of my imagination.


----- Original Message -----

From: Ron Beaulieu


Sent: Wednesday, July 08, 2009 11:04 AM

Subject: Re: [AdventistHotIssues] Re: Seventh-day Adventist Church Leadership is Heavily Masonic


Brother George,


Jesuit Catholic Masons (and there is no contradiction here as you know!) have infiltrated every church! I fully believe that Dr. B. B. Beach is one of them, and his ecumenical oriented replacement, John Graz, is another!


About Us | Public Affairs and Religious Liberty Department of the ...

Dr. John Graz, a citizen of both Switzerland and France, ... for the General Conference of the Seventh-day Adventist Church, and United Nations liaison. ... - Cached - Similar


 The highest leaders are guilty of all the abominations cited in Ezekiel 8. But you and I don't know the WORST ABOMINATIONS.


     "The abominations for which the faithful ones were sighing and crying were all that could be discerned by finite eyes, but by far the worst sins, those which provoked the jealousy of the pure and holy God, were unrevealed. The great Searcher of hearts knoweth every sin committed in secret by the workers of iniquity. These persons come to feel secure in their deceptions and, because of His long-suffering, say that the Lord seeth not, and then act as though He had forsaken the earth. But He will detect their hypocrisy and will open before others those sins which they were so careful to hide." {5T 211.3}


     "No superiority of rank, dignity, or worldly wisdom, no position in sacred office, will preserve men from sacrificing principle when left to their own deceitful hearts. Those who have been regarded as worthy and righteous prove to be ring-leaders in apostasy and examples in indifference and in the abuse of God's mercies. Their wicked course He will tolerate no longer, and in His wrath He deals with them without mercy. {5T 212.1}


     "It is with reluctance that the Lord withdraws His presence from those who have been blessed with great light and who have felt the power of the word in ministering to others. They were once His faithful servants, favored with His presence and guidance; but they departed from Him and led others into error, and therefore are brought under the divine displeasure. {5T 212.2}




----- Original Message -----

From: George


Sent: Wednesday, July 08, 2009 10:46 AM

Subject: [AdventistHotIssues] Re: Seventh-day Adventist Church Leadership is Heavily Masonic


Thank you Ron for confirmation. The Lord told me years ago the same
thing about SDA Corporation being confiscated by Jewish Masonry. I do
think there is already an organized lodge at the highest level. The Lord
is calling this corporation by its real name: The Synagogue of Satan
because this is the more comprehensive definition of a Masonic lodge. If
this argument is not sufficient for people like Paulo's family to
get out of this devil's business what should we do more to convince
them? While speaking about SDA Corporation, just for avoiding a long
chain of stereotypical explanations, I call it "the most perfect
pyramidal Masonic structure"


--- In, "Ron Beaulieu" <rsbeauli@...


 Fully agree!


   ----- Original Message -----
   From: luke19v10
   Sent: Wednesday, July 08, 2009 3:37 AM
   Subject: [AdventistHotIssues] Seventh-day Adventist Church
   Leadership is Heavily Masonic

   Neal Wilson, president of the General Conference of Seventh-day
Adventists (left) exchanges an indisputable (in my opinion) Masonic
handshake with Konstantin Kharchev, the Soviet Union's Chairman of the
Ministry of Religious Affairs. The occasion was a socialist-sponsored
environmental conclave, called the International Forum for a Non-nuclear
World and the Survival of Humanity, February 13-15, 1987.

   The leadership of the Seventh-day Adventist Church (SDA) is heavily
Masonic. Many SDA officials have cooperated with pro-Communist, anti-
Christian lobby groups such as Americans United, People For the
American Way, the American Civil Liberties Union, and the Jewish ADL.

   These groups veil their anti- Christian positions with
high-sounding goals like "liberty" and "separation of church and state."
(Photo and article: Ministry magazine, May/June 1987, p. 7)

   Excerpt From:\\