Meeting the Blatant Heresies


Russell Unterschultz


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----- Original Message -----

From: Ron Beaulieu

To: ;

Sent: Wednesday, September 08, 2010 4:52 AM



In view of Russell Unterschultz's ongoing attempts to convince Brian of his errant theories on the Godhead, I would recommend reviewing this document.


Ellen White says that Satan speaks in smooth and mellow tones. Russell has assumed that stance in his presentation of error on the Godhead. He fully eliminates any persons to the Godhead but the Father. The serious implications of this heresy are:


·       The Father would have to die as the Testator of the Everlasting Covenant.

·       Jesus would not be equal to the Father in being the Testator to the Everlasting Covenant.

·       In John 14, three persons come to us: The Father, the Comforter and Christ. Read it all for yourself.

·       Ellen White defines the Holy Spirit as the soul of the life of Christ, His Divine Nature which He bequeathed to us when He commended that Spirit through the eternal Spirit to the Father on the Cross.

·       Russell's view that there is only ONE PERSON to the Godhead, totally annihilates the eternal Incarnation sacrifice of the Son of God in divesting His Holy Spirit PERSONality from His humanity as a gift to man whereby they might overcome and be regenerated back into the image of God.

·       The Trinity Doctrine annihilates that "highest good, crowning gift" sacrifice by saying that the Holy Spirit always existed as a THIRD PERSON, without the sacrifice of Christ (The Son) divesting Himself of His Divine Nature Holy Spirit as a gift for us. Russell's view achieves the same end by denying that the Son of God was equal to the Father as a party to the Godhead who thus qualified to enter into the Testators Covenant. If the Son of God did not so qualify, the Sanctuary and Atonement never occurred. This is the implication of Russell's theory of the Godhead--being ONE PERSON--the Father.

·       We don't pray to the Holy Spirit because we pray to the Son, Jesus, that His Holy Spirit Divine Nature be sent to us by the Father, to whom Christ commended that Spirit through the eternal Spirit on the Cross just before He died. That Holy Spirit descended upon Him at His baptism, and was retained by Him until He commended it back to the Father before His death. Thus, divinity did not die on the cross as Ellen White testifies.

·       Russell teaches that Christ is not equal to the Father. Scripture and Ellen White say He is equal to the Father, though in His "emptied" state of a servant while here on earth, He voluntarily made Himself fully dependent upon the Father. Such statements in Scripture should not be confounded to mean that Christ was not fully God in the highest sense as Ellen White says, and which statement Russell fully contradicts.

·       What Russell is teaching is antichrist heresy which renders the Sanctuary Service Atonement in the heavenly Sanctuary as GONE, because only one equal to the Father could make an atonement for any breach in His law.

·       "Christ was God essentially, and in the highest sense. He was with God from all eternity, God over all, blessed forevermore." {RH, April 5, 1906 par. 6}

·       "The Lord Jesus Christ, the divine Son of God, existed from eternity, a distinct person, yet one with the Father." {RH, April 5, 1906 par. 7}

·       Ellen White said that the meaning of Christ being begotten refers to His Incarnation. Sorry, I don’t have the quote, but I have read it. And the empirical proof that this has to be true is the fact that she said Christ existed from all eternity.

·       Jesus could not be fully God IN THE HIGHEST SENSE, and be inferior to the Father.

·       Russell believes that Christ was begotten in the sense of being derived from the Father. Ellen White said that Christ was not derived from the Father.

·       Jesus referred to Himself as the Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, WHICH IS TO COME--Rev. 1.

·       Russell TOTALLY DENIES THREE PERSONS TO THE GODHEAD. See Ellen White's statement below and the words "...third person of the Godhead."

·       Thus, Russell Unterschultz does not speak according to the law (the Everlasting Testators covenant) nor the Testimonies. He is thus deceived and a deceiver. He has refused instruction and persists in error. He is thus antichrist.

·       Russell Unterschultz believes he knows more than the Holy Spirit gift to the church via Ellen White. He believes he knows more than God in Revelation 1. This is how brazen he really is despite his protracted mild manner. Satan will try to work you every and any which way he can!

·       I tried kind appeals to Russell with evidence he cannot and has not disproven. But he persists so he must be met straight on in no uncertain terms. All who embrace his views will be as antichrist as antichrist can get.


"The Holy Spirit invites all genuine prayer. I have learned to know that in all my intercessions, the Spirit intercedes for me and for all saints whose intercessions are according to the will of God, never contrary to His will. "The Spirit also helpeth our infirmities" [Rom. 8:26], and the Spirit being God, knoweth the mind of God; therefore in every prayer of ours for the sick, or for other needs, the will of God is to be regarded. "For what man knoweth the things of man, save the spirit of man which is in him? Even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God" [2 Cor. 2:11]. If we are taught of God, we shall pray in conformity to His revealed will and in submission to His will which we know not. We are to make supplication according to the will of God, relying on the precious Word, and believing that Christ not only gave Himself for, but to, His disciples. The record declares, "He breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost" [John 20:22]. {2MR 36.2}


MR No. 240 - The Holy Spirit


     We are living in the dispensation of the Spirit; we hold in our hands the promise of His Spirit, and ministers may be qualified to give the trumpet a certain sound, to arouse the sleeping people and set them at work for themselves and for others out of the fold.--Letter 15, 1889. {4MR 329.1}


     The Holy Spirit is to be presented in every discourse. What wonderful statements Christ has made concerning His representative to the world! This is the theme of encouragement to be kept before the people. In comprehending the office of the Holy Spirit, we shall bring all blessings to ourselves. He will make us complete in Christ.--Ms 8, 1898. {4MR 329.2}


     The promised outpouring of God's life-giving Spirit has been and is still the great hope of God's people. It is the hope and glory of Zion. In this time of spiritual declension God's ministry is to stand in dignity, efficiency, and power.--Ms. 14, 1901. {4MR 329.3}


Note by Ron: There is ONE ETERNAL SPIRIT--THE ETERNAL SPIRIT, through which Christ offerred up His Divine life on the cross. The Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit of the Son which He bequeathed to us at His Incarnation in the heavenly Sanctuary Atonement (first death) and then again on the Cross (second eternal death to that life ONLY), are the three persons to the Godhead. Any denial of the THIRD PERSON, denies the eternal sacrifice incurred by the THIRD PERSON on our behalf. It was that heavenly Sanctuary/Atonement sacrifice that met the prescribed limit of a sacrifice BEFORE THE Cross, TO WIT:


Hbr 9:14       How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God? 


     He will impart His Holy Spirit in the plenitude of His reviving, and there shall not be room enough to receive it. Nothing but the baptism of the Holy Spirit can bring up the church to its right position, and prepare the people of God for the fast approaching conflict.--Letter 15, 1889. {4MR 329.4}


     Evil has been accumulating for centuries and could only be resisted by the mighty power of the Holy Spirit, the Third Person of the Godhead. . . .


Another spirit must be met; for the essence of evil was working in all ways, and the submission of man to this satanic captivity was amazing.--Letter 8, 1896. {4MR 329.5}


     A message will soon be given by God's appointment that will swell into a loud cry. . . . We are standing upon the borders of the greatest event in the world's history, and Satan must not have power over the people of God, causing them to sleep on. The papacy will appear in its power. . . . The time of trouble is near, and we are to awake to a realization of this.--Letter 54, 1906. {4MR 330.1}


     All human effort combined is weakness without the deep moving of the Spirit of God. . . . Without His help the deep learning and restless energy of a Paul, the eloquence and talent of an Apollos, will fall infinitely short of convicting and bringing one soul to repentance. . . . While man can do nothing without God, the Lord would do nothing without the human channel.--Letter 85, 1898. {4MR 330.2}


     Unless the human agent inclines his heart to do God's will, and takes up God's service, the light will shine in vain. A thousandfold more light and conviction would accomplish nothing. God knows he has had sufficient evidence already.--Letter 135, 1898. {4MR 330.3}

     The only power that can quicken the heart into activity is the power which will give life to the dead--the Holy Spirit of God. . . . Hang your


helpless soul upon your Mediator. In and through Him, and Him alone, you can come to God. . . . The Holy Spirit is your hope.--Letter 124, 1901. {4MR 330.4}


     We do not want more of God any more urgently than He wants all there is of us to be consecrated to His service.--Undated Ms 73. {4MR 331.1}

     The more we discover our real need, our real poverty, the more we desire the gift of the Holy Spirit. . . . It is because we do not see our need, do not realize our poverty, that we do not pour forth earnest entreaties, looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith for the bestowal of the blessing.--Ms 3, 1892. {4MR 331.2}


     The Spirit is constantly showing to the soul glimpses of the things of God. . . . The Spirit's energy is working in the heart and leading the inclinations of the will to Jesus by living faith and complete dependence on Divine power to will and to do of His good pleasure. The Spirit taketh the things of God, just as fast as the soul resolves, and acts in accordance with the light revealed.--Letter 135, 1898. {4MR 331.3}


     Of what avail would it have been to us that the only begotten Son of God had humbled Himself, endured the temptations of the wily foe and wrestled with him during His entire life on earth, and died the just for the unjust . . . if the Spirit had not been given as a constant, working, regenerating agent to make effectual in our cases what had been wrought out by the world's Redeemer.--Ms 1, 1892.

                                    -332- {4MR 331.4}

     When the Holy Spirit is allowed to do His work on human hearts, self will be crucified.--Letter 270, 1907. {4MR 332.1}


     Subjection to the Word of God means the restoration of one's self. Let Christ work by His Holy Spirit, and awaken you as from the dead.--Letter 8, 1896. {4MR 332.2}


     Receiving the Spirit of Christ, every one of His followers will fulfil a divinely appointed mission not merely to be an influence among influences, but to be a special influence for God in every sense of the term.--Ms 130, 1902. {4MR 332.3}


     If received and appreciated, the Holy Spirit will make us holy, Christlike.--Letter 178, 1907. {4MR 332.4}


     The influence of the Holy Spirit is the life of Christ in the soul. . . . Those who know the indwelling of the Spirit reveal the fruit of the Spirit--love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith.--Ms 41, 1896. {4MR 332.5}


     The purification through the Spirit must take place in their minds and hearts. Unless this divine principle is brought into the life and practice, there can be no such fruit borne as unfeigned, fervent love for one another. --Ms 63, 1900.

                                    -333- {4MR 332.6}

     We cannot render to God supreme love and honor if we do not recognize the Holy Spirit.--Ms 59, 1900. {4MR 333.1}


     He who yields himself to the control of His Spirit lays hold of Christ with the living grasp of an earnest, definite faith, an intensity of love that nothing can quench.--Letter 10, 1899. {4MR 333.2}


     "He shall not speak of Himself," He said, "He shall glorify Me." As Christ came to glorify the Father by the revelation of His infinite love, so the Spirit came to glorify Christ.--Letter 213, 1903. {4MR 333.3}


     James and John thought that for the asking they could have the highest place in the kingdom of God. . . . They did not realize that before they could share Christ's glory, they must wear His yoke.--Letter 22, 1902. {4MR 333.4}


     The reason why the Holy Spirit does not work among us . . . is the unbelief in God and the lack of confidence in one another. This was the work of the power of darkness to lead us to suspect our brethren and stand apart as criticizers.--Letter 7, 1899. {4MR 333.5}


     As a people we need to seek most earnestly for the energizing power of the Holy Spirit.--Letter 200, 1902. {4MR 333.6}

     If we obtain the victory we must be earnest ourselves and plead with God


for His Holy Spirit. We must talk and pray in faith that we may have the precious anointment of the Holy Spirit.--Letter 230, 1899. {4MR 333.7}


     To those who in faith claimed this promise it was speedily fulfilled. . . . As the disciples made humble supplication to God, their differences were swept away. They became of one mind. Then the way was prepared for the Holy Spirit to enter the cleansed, consecrated soul temples. Every heart was filled with the Spirit.--Ms 21, 1900. {4MR 334.1}


     We are too easily satisfied with limited, special, far-between blessings. We are to lay hold of God by faith and labor to bring souls to Christ. We are too dull in our doctrinal discourses upon the truth as it is in Jesus. . . . Come in consecration to holier ground, and still holier. . . . Let the truth take hold of the spiritual part of our own nature, and then the current of divine power will be communicated to those whom we address.--Letter 230, 1899. {4MR 334.2}


     The Holy Spirit invites all genuine prayer. I have learned to know that, in all my intercessions, the Spirit intercedes for me and for all saints whose intercessions are according to the will of God, we shall pray in conformity to His revealed will, and in submission to His will which we know not. . . . Jesus is waiting to breathe upon all His disciples, and give them the inspiration of His sanctifying Spirit, and transfuse the vital influence from Himself to His people. . . . Their will must be submitted to His will, they must act with His Spirit that it may be no more they that live, but


Christ that liveth in them. Jesus is seeking to impress upon them the thought that in giving His Holy Spirit He is giving to them the glory which the Father hath given Him.--Letter 11b, 1892. {4MR 334.3}


     The Lord Jesus has placed Himself under obligation never to disappoint a true seeker for the Holy Spirit's guidance.--Letter 68, 1900. {4MR 335.1}


     Those who beg at midnight for loaves to feed the hungry souls, will be successful. The law of God is that as we receive we are to impart. . . . In the name of the Lord I entreat you, ask and receive the Holy Spirit. Press to the side of Christ. But this Spirit can only be received by those who are consecrated, who will deny self, lifting the cross and following the Lord.--Letter 10, 1899. {4MR 335.2}


     Pray, Oh, pray most earnestly, "Put Thy Spirit, Lord, Thy Holy Spirit, within my heart, that I may be sincere in keeping my baptismal vow." --Ms 130, 1902. {4MR 335.3}


     Seasons of prayer should be held for the outpouring of the Holy Spirit.--Letter 292, 1907. {4MR 335.4}


     Could there be a convocation of all the churches on earth, the object of their united cry should be for the Holy Spirit. When we have that, Christ our sufficiency is ever present, we shall have every want supplied. We shall have the mind of Christ.-- Letter 114, 1894.  {4MR 335.5}


     God will not do for man that which He requires man shall do for himself through his own earnest willing cooperation. . . . He cannot of himself move one step toward Christ without the Spirit of God draws him, and this drawing is ever, and will continue until man grieves the Holy Ghost by his persistent refusal.--Letter 135, 1898. {4MR 336.1}


     Time and time again the Lord has longed to communicate His Spirit in rich measure, but there was no place for Him to rest. He was not recognized or valued. The blindness of mind, the hardness of hearts interpreted Him as something of which they should be afraid. Some hidden evil lurks in the heart to hinder the manifestation of the power of God, and His Spirit cannot descend.--Letter 43, 1890. {4MR 336.2}


     Before giving us the baptism of the Holy Spirit, our heavenly Father will try us, to see if we can live without dishonoring Him. . . . Do not think that you can have great spiritual blessings without complying with the conditions God Himself has laid down.--Letter 22, 1902. {4MR 336.3}


     When God's people will believe, when they will turn their attention to that which is true, and living, and real, the Holy Spirit, in strong heavenly currents, will be poured upon the church.--Ms 21, 1900. {4MR 336.4}


     Arouse from your deathlike slumbers. . . . Come into right connection with Him by yielding to the creating power of the Holy Spirit. Then will be seen in the church the unity that is of value in God's sight.--Ms 64, 1898.

                                    -337- {4MR 336.5}

     Fields of labor were opened to be worked, and all found wherever they went in Christ's name, His representative in the Holy Spirit opened the hearts and doors for the disciples. All were of one mind and all felt that their resources must be taxed to the uttermost of their ability. A work was before them to preach Christ and Him crucified through the whole world.--Ms 130, 1901. {4MR 337.1}


     The religion of Christ means much more than forgiveness of sins. It means taking away ours, and filling the vacuum with the Holy Spirit. It means divine illumination, rejoicing in God.--Ms 2, 1899. {4MR 337.2}


     His Spirit will be communicated to human instrumentalities, giving them light before which moral darkness must flee away.--Letter 43, 1890. {4MR 337.3}


     God's message to each of us is, My son, give Me thine heart.". . . Then open the heart to the Divine Spirit and you will appreciate the value of the human soul. . . . {4MR 337.4}


     The power of the Holy Spirit is drawing to God all who will be drawn. He is convincing men that the commandments of God are a life and death question with them.--Ms 44, 1900. {4MR 337.5}


     Unless we can feel brotherly love for those around us, the Holy Spirit cannot work upon our hearts and minds.--Letter 68, 1896.

                                    -338- {4MR 337.6}

     The soul who yields his heart to be worked by the Holy Spirit will be a living channel of light in the inculcation of the precepts and truth of the Word of God, winning others to obedience of the commandments of God.--Ms. 166, 1897. {4MR 338.1}


     The question is sometimes asked, "Why, if we have the truth, do we not see a greater manifestation of the Spirit of God?" God cannot reveal Himself till those who profess to be Christians are doers of His word in their private lives, till there is oneness with Christ, a sanctification of body, soul, and spirit. Then they will be fit temples for the indwelling of the Holy Spirit.--Letter 139, 1898. {4MR 338.2}


     I would that we had the baptism of the Holy Spirit, and this we must have before we can reveal perfection of life and character. I would that each member of the church would open the heart to Jesus, saying, "Come, heavenly Guest, abide with me."--Letter 139, 1898. {4MR 338.3}


     Those who are imbued with His Spirit will have an intense love for everyone for whom He has died, and will work earnestly to bring into the heavenly garner a harvest of souls. Filled with His Spirit, men and women will be animated with the same desire to save sinners that animated Christ in His lifework as a missionary sent of God.--Ms 130, 1902.

Released July 14, 1970. {4MR 338.4}


All blessings,




----- Original Message -----

From: Ron Beaulieu


Sent: Tuesday, September 07, 2010 8:44 AM

Subject: Fw: Hello and response to your letter


Brian and Russell,


Thank you Bryan for giving me an opportunity to respond to Russells private response to you.


I am responding to Brian's private post to me regarding a private email to Brian from Russell. Key to my response is Revelation 1, wherein Christ is speaking when He says:


6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen. 7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen. 8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty. Revelation 1:6-8.


Christ, the Son, is the only one of the Godhead which WAS (before the Incarnation and before the cross), and which IS to come. Here, He clearly refers to Himself as the Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending. It seems that Russell believes that Ellen White's statements that Christ is underived, were tampered with by the editors at the White Estate. However, Russell will have more difficulty proving that Revelation 1:6-8 has been edited the writers at the White Estate! But he just ignores such evidence that proves him wrong.


Also key to my response are Ellen White's statements on the everlasting existence of Christ. I once read a statement by Ellen White that His being begotten means the Incarnation from His former estate to His being combined with humanity. I can't find the statement at this time, but this meaning is strongly suggested in the following verse:


14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.


I told Russell openly on this forum that I had no objection to him responding to Brian's questions on this forum. He chose not to do that and wrote to Brian privately. I would hereby request Russell, that you send any responses to me that you send to members of this forum privately that I might have a fair opportunity to respond. I consider the request a fair and just expectation since you are a member of this forum and are using the member(s) to ply your theories on the Godhead.


Scripture says that Christ was slain from the foundation of the earth. This is crucial to any meaning of Him being "begotten" BEFORE COMING TO THIS EARTH AND HIS DEATH ON THE CROSS. What is often ignored regarding this issue is the Sanctuary Service involving this "begotten" Incarnation process that began in heaven.


It appears that in Russell's response to Brian, he is questioning the everlasting existence of the Son. This would contradict statements by Ellen White and Scripture to the contrary, such as Revelation 1 where Christ is speaking when He says He is the Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end--the one that is to come. Jesus is speaking for the Father is not coming. 


It all reduces to the fact that Christ was the Testator of the Everlasting Covenant, and if He is not equal to God, there has been no atonement for any breach in God's Law. Only one equal to God could atone for any breach in that law. Thus, Russell's theory on the Godhead obfuscates the Sanctuary Atonement Service in heaven. The Sanctuary is rendered Gone. The Atonement is Gone. The entire Christian economy is swept away by his theory which is the same thing effected by the Trinity Doctrine which he professes to disclaim. This may be the reason why Russell chooses to bypass me and go to others privately, because I can identify the error of his interpretations.


Involved with that Sanctuary Service in the heavenly Sanctuary, was the Son having met the prescribed limits of the Sacrifice BEFORE THE CROSS.


As Russell says, the Son was surely begotten in the Sanctuary Service Incarnation before He came to earth, but not in the sense that Russell claims. He means to say that the Son was not as eternal as the Father and thus is not equal to the Father having been derived from the Father. This is why I early posed the question to Russell: How did the Incarnation meet the prescribed limit as a sacrifice, BUT NOT AS A REDEEMER? He never responded to that question as I recall. A correct answer to that question would clear many of the problems Russell is having with the Godhead issue.


 "The darkness rolled away from the Saviour and from the Cross. Christ bowed His head and died. In His Incarnation He had reached the prescribed limit as a sacrifice, but not as a redeemer." E.G. White Manuscript Releases Volume Twelve, p. 409.


"The Lord possessed me in the beginning of his way." Prov. 8:22.

"Before the mountains were settled, before the hills was I brought forth." Prov. 8:25.


"God always has been. He is the great I AM. The psalmist declares, "Before the mountains were brought forth, or ever thou hadst formed the earth and the world, even from everlasting to everlasting, thou art God." Ps. 90:2. He is the high and lofty One that inhabiteth eternity. "I am the Lord, I change not," He declares. With Him there is no variableness, neither shadow of turning. He is "the same yesterday, and to day and for ever." Heb. 13:8. He is infinite and omnipresent. No words of ours can describe His greatness and majesty. {FLB 42.3}"


Ellen White is speaking of Christ who claimed to be the I AM.


The above two verses interpreted so that nothing contradicts as regards the everlasting existence of the Son, would have to be interpreted as meaning that from the foundation of the earth the Son was Incarnated (brought forth) into another Being. And indeed Scripture testifies that Christ was slain from the foundation of the earth. That would mean its planning stage if we interpret every word so that nothing contradicts:


Rev 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.


Another proof that the Son was Incarnation from the foundation of the earth is that the Holy Spirit (the soul of His Life) took part in the working out of the plan of redemption before the earth was created.


Pledged themselves -- ALL THREE: "The Godhead was stirred with pity for the race, and the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit gave Themselves to the working out of the plan of redemption. In order to fully carry out this plan, it was decided that Christ, the only-begotten Son of God, should give Himself an offering for sin. What line can measure the depth of this love? God would make it impossible for man to say that He could have done more. With Christ He gave all the resources of heaven, that nothing might be wanting in the plan for man's uplifting. Here is love--the contemplation of which should fill the soul with inexpressible gratitude! Oh, what love, what matchless love! The contemplation of this love will cleanse the soul from all selfishness. It will lead the disciple to deny self, take up the cross, and follow the Redeemer." E.G. White, Councils on Health, pp. 222, 223.


Pledged themselves: Father and Son -- "As the divine Sufferer hung upon the cross, angels gathered about Him, and as they looked upon Him, and heard His cry, they asked, with intense emotion, 'Will not the Lord Jehovah save Him?' ... Then were the words spoken: 'The Lord hath sworn, and He will not repent. FATHER AND SON ARE PLEDGED TO FULFILL THE TERMS OF THE EVERLASTING COVENANT. God so loved the world, that He gave His only-begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.' Christ was not alone in making His great sacrifice. It was the fulfillment of the covenant made between Him and His Father before the foundation of the world was laid. With clasped hands they had entered into the solemn pledge that Christ would become the surety for the human race if they were overcome by Satan's sophistry." E.G. White, The Faith I Live By, p. 76.


Begotten -- Before all creation (Proverbs 8:22-31 and Colossians 1:15.

"The Lord possessed me in the beginning of his way, before his works of old. I was set up from everlasting, from the beginning, or ever the earth was. When there were no depths, I was brought forth when there were no fountains abounding with water. Before the mountains were settled, before the hills was I brought forth: While as yet he had not made the earth, nor the fields, nor the highest part of the dust of the world. When he prepared the heavens, I was there: when he set a compass upon the face of the depth: When he established the clouds above: when he strengthened the fountains of the deep: When he gave to the sea his decree, that the waters should not pass his commandment: when he appointed the foundations of the earth: Then I was by him, as one brought up with him: and I was daily his delight, rejoicing always before him Rejoicing in the habitable part of his earth and my delights were with the sons of men." Proverbs 8:22-31.


The above statement should be interpreted to mean that Christ was Incarnated from the beginning, or ever the earth was--or from the foundation of the earth--when it was planned--rather than the Son being brought forth by being created or coming forth as created from the bosom of the Father. From the bosom of the Father means from of the same substance--SPIRIT, if we interpret so that nothing contradicts.


For example, if Brian, Russell and myself are brought up with one another, that implies we all existed at the same time.


"In stooping to take upon Himself humanity, Christ revealed a character the opposite of the character of Satan. . . . In taking our nature, the Saviour has bound Himself to humanity by a tie that is never to be broken. Through the eternal ages He is linked with us. "God so loved the world, that He gave His only-begotten Son." John 3:16. He gave Him not only to bear our sins, and to die as our sacrifice He gave Him to the fallen race. To assure us of His immutable counsel of peace, God gave His only-begotten Son to become one of the human family, forever to retain His human nature. This is the pledge that God will fulfill His word. "Unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon His shoulder." God has adopted human nature in the person of His Son, and has carried the same into the highest heaven."--Ibid., p. 25. {7ABC 456.4}


"The Father demonstrates His infinite love for Christ, who paid our ransom with His blood, by receiving and welcoming Christ's friends as His friends. He is satisfied with the atonement made. He is glorified by the incarnation, the life, death, and mediation of His Son."--Testimonies, vol. 6, p. 364. {7ABC 460.2}


Ellen White did not overlook the "in the bosom of the Father" factor:


“However much a shepherd may love his sheep, he loves his sons and daughters more. Jesus is not only our shepherd He is our "everlasting Father." And He says, "I know Mine own, and Mine own know Me, even as the Father knoweth Me, and I know the Father." John 10:14, 15, R.V. What a statement is this!--the only-begotten Son, He who is in the bosom of the Father, He whom God has declared to be "the Man that is My fellow" (Zech. 13:7),--the communion between Him and the eternal God is taken to represent the communion between Christ and His children on the earth!”--The Desire of Ages, p. 483. {7ABC 438.4}



Act 13:33 God hath fulfilled the same unto us their children, in that he hath raised up Jesus again; as it is also written in the second psalm, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee.


Jesus was raised up again from death. When was He first raised from death? In the heavenly Sanctuary when He was slain from the foundation of the earth?


Rev 1:5 And from Jesus Christ, [who is] the faithful witness, [and] the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood,


When did the VERY FIRST DEATH OCCUR--I mean DEATH PERIOD? Answer: At the Incarnation Sanctuary in heaven when Christ was slain from the foundation of the earth. Then after His death on the cross, Jesus was raised up AGAIN. Russell does not consider this fact which would solve some of the issues he uses as a wrong premise for his theory.


Hbr 1:5 For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?


Hbr 5:5 So also Christ glorified not himself to be made an high priest; but he that said unto him, Thou art my Son, to day have I begotten thee.


Hbr 5:5 So also Christ glorified not himself to be made an high priest; but he that said unto him, Thou art my Son, to day have I begotten thee.


The meaning of "begotten" Son in John 1:18 is only child as defined in #3439 below.


Jhn 1:18 No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath


declared [him].
Jhn 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should

not perish, but have everlasting life.

Jhn 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he

hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

1Jo 4:9 In this was manifested the love of God toward us, because that God sent his only begotten Son into the

world, that we might live through him.

Number 3439


monogenes {mon-og-en-ace'}

Word Origin:

from 3441 and 1096



Part of Speech:


Usage in the KJV:

only begotten 6, only 2, only child 1

Total: 9


1.    single of its kind, only

1.    used of only sons or daughters (viewed in relation to their parents)

2.    used of Christ, denotes the only begotten son of God

TDNT - Theological Dictionary of the New Testament
TWOT - Theological Word Book of the Old Testament



----- Original Message -----

From: Brian

To: Ron Beaulieu

Sent: Monday, September 06, 2010 8:20 PM

Subject: Fw: Hello and response to your letter


Brother Ron, I didn't check my email for a while but Russel did indeed reply back to my questions. I am forwarding it to you. i will inform him that you did not write what you thought you wrote.


--- On Sat, 8/28/10, Russell Unterschultz <

> wrote:

From: Russell Unterschultz <>
Subject: Hello and response to your letter
To: "Brian" <>
Date: Saturday, August 28, 2010, 5:51 PM

Hello Brian: Thanks for writing. Please see attachment.


----- Original Message -----

From: Ron Beaulieu


Sent: Tuesday, September 07, 2010 9:08 AM

Subject: Re: Hello and response to your letter

Just to keep the issue between Russell and myself as clear as crystal, the problems are:



----- Original Message -----

From: Ron Beaulieu


Sent: Tuesday, September 07, 2010 9:25 AM

Subject: Re: Hello and response to your letter

Russell believes the following statement by Ellen White was tampered with by the leaders when Desire of Ages was written, because a similar statement appears in that book. However, the following statement is from the Signs of the Times, of April 8, 1897. I have the photo copies of the original Signs of the Times articles, and the statement was not altered.


"In Him was life; and the life was the light of men'.  (John 1:4) It is not physical life that is here specified, but immortality, the life which is exclusively the property of God. The Word, who was with God, and who was God had this life. Physical life is something which each individual receives. It is not eternal or immortal; for God, the Life-giver, takes it again. Man has no control over his life. But the life of Christ was unborrowed. No one can take this life from Him. `I lay it down of myself'. (John 10:18), He said. In Him was life, original, unborrowed, underived. This life is not inherent in man. He can possess it only through Christ. He cannot earn it; it is given him as a free gift if he will believe in Christ as His personal Saviour. `This is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent'. (John 17:3). This is the open fountain of life for the world."  Signs of the Times, April 8, 1897. 1 Selected Messages pp. 296, 297.


But neither Russell nor anyone else is dependent on Ellen White on this all serious issue of the Godhead. Ellen White said that the Godhead (the personality of God and Christ) is a pillar doctrine. Do you really think God would allow a pillar, landmark doctrine to be polluted by the leaders? Did He send us the gift of prophecy that we might all be in unity till He comes, only to let it be changed and perverted on such an important issues as the Godhead? I think not! And all you really need to know is that Ellen White's statement is in agreement with Revelation 1:6-8.


 8 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty. Revelation 1:6-8.


How do you know for sure that these verses speak of Christ? Because He is the Alpha and Omega WHICH IS TO COME! The Father is not COMING TO THIS EARTH in a second coming as far as I know.




----- Original Message -----

From: Ron Beaulieu

To: ;

Sent: Tuesday, September 07, 2010 9:36 AM

Subject: Re: Hello and response to your letter

It is often charged against me that I become angry with any who disagree with me. That is not true. That false charge is actuated by the spirit of Satan. No one could disagree with me on ANY MORE IMPORTANT issue than the Godhead, AS RUSSELL surely does, but I am not angry with Russell. I pity him and all who do now have spiritual discernment to see the clear truth. I pray for him that he will change his antichrist belief on the Godhead issue.


All blessings,




----- Original Message -----

From: Ron Beaulieu

To: ;

Sent: Tuesday, September 07, 2010 10:33 AM

Subject: Re: Hello and response to your letter

Brother Brian,


In response to Russell's query:


"Brian, would you agree from the evidence presented in this paper that Jesus Christ was truly begotten (born) of His Father before they created all things?"


The correct answer is YES! But Russell's understanding that Christ was begotton (derived from) the Father is incorrect. The way in which Jesus Christ was begotten of His Father before they created all things, is that the Incarnation in the Sanctuary Service of Heaven BEGAN before the creation of the earth when Christ was slain from the foundation of the earth.


Rev 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.


Christ was slain (Incarnated) from the foundation of the earth--before the earth was created. Christ was thus "begotten" of the Father (Incarnated into another form) before the earth was created. This is part of the mystery we do not understand, nevertheless, Scripture tells us that the Son was slain at that time and this took place in the heavenly Sanctuary Service.